It's highly questionable as to whether the confederate flag ever stood for "freedom, independence, and self reliance"

Really can't be fighting for "self reliance" if you're fighting to keep your economy and society reliant on slaves.

I was born and raised in the north, but don't view the flag as a symbol of racism. I see it as nothing more than a symbol of rebellion due to them seceding from the Union. Both sides had slaves and segregation. Slavery ended at the end of the Civil War, but segregation didn't end until almost a hundred years later in 1964 with the Civil Rights Act.

We can't just mark our side as noble heroes and everyone else as horrendous villains

In UK they ban people from flying their own flag on their house or car because it's racist.

You just have dronelike propagandized vision, like most people today.

In UK they ban people from flying their own flag on their house or car because it's racist.

You just have dronelike propagandized vision, like most people today.

There is a wonderful irony in the second statement as the first statement simply isn't true.

While flying the flag isn't common (because in the UK we don't get all precious about such things any more), get to around a major sporting event and you can't move for seeing it hanging off cars, houses, flats and draped around people, be it the St. George Cross or the Union Flag.

Whilst it isn't true there were some councils a few years ago decided to imagine that it was. A friend of mine was escorted out of Birmingham city centre by a fleet of police cars because he had a st george cross painted on the roof of his mini and the police deemed it to be an offensive symbol. He did file a complaint and ended up receiving an apology from the police. There were a few similar incidents around the same time so much so that it actually got mentioned during PMQ.

Also whilst the St George flag isn't banned it has been taken up by many far right racist groups such as the EDL, NF and the BNP and it does come across as having similar baring as the confederate flag.

Also whilst the St George flag isn't banned it has been taken up by many far right racist groups such as the EDL, NF and the BNP and it does come across as having similar baring as the confederate flag.

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It's amazing how quickly a symbol can get hijacked by a group, which changes it's meaning completely !

Also whilst the St George flag isn't banned it has been taken up by many far right racist groups such as the EDL, NF and the BNP

...not to even mention football violence which is often perpetrated by people carrying st. george flags...

ChaosEngine, care to cite some reliable source stating that the Confederate Battle flag is and only is a symbol of racism? You are giving it that label, and a large number of racist bigots may indirectly give it that label, but to many others it stands for rather different things.

Also care to cite some reliable source that states that everyone who fought for the South in the US Civil War directly supported slavery. You are over simplifying a highly complex issue, and being as bigoted and closed minded as the people you're complaining about.

Also whilst the St George flag isn't banned it has been taken up by many far right racist groups such as the EDL, NF and the BNP

...not to even mention football violence which is often perpetrated by people carrying st. george flags...

To be fair I tend to lump football hooligans and far right racists all together and more often than not I turn out to be correct.

As for the St Georges flag actually being associated with football violence I think this is a little unfair as most domestic football violence are using their teams colors and not the England flag and most international football violence usually only involves England fans as the victims. It is generally Daily Mirror readers who see rowdy football chanting and boisterous behaviour and immediately assume them to be rioting louts. There hasn't really been any large scale football violence involving England fans since the 80s.

I think the Ireland, England match would disagree with you