The idea of adventure quests, where you can do something with certain ability''s like: moving stones, jumping higher/further, running faster, swimming and other ability''s like those could be worth while.

Some good games could be: Bomberman quest(gba), zelda, darkages.com and evolva.

You can also take some ideas from movies like Indiana Jones, Hackers and other adventure movies.

I kind of like the Cleric/healer idea you gave. Imagine forming a team of wizards and clerics with one goal, to revert undead to living, to remove evil spirits in bodies, or to simply cast spells which send evil demons through a portal back to hell.

Weapons, you can still use weapons, but they are weapons of divinidy. Arrows with holly water which when they hit an evil spirit or undead, they begin to revert to a past "good" state.

Why is your team doing all this. Well obviously you need to create a story where an evil force, or an evil team opposite yours, or the devil himself Mr Diablo, is ROAMING THE LANDS, converting all to enslaved undead, evil doers, and what not.

You obviously need to quit asking for advice and just start thinking about this, because it took me the time to type this out to come up with a Reason, a Plot, and some actions to perform!!!! (all in under 5 minutes) Damn, maybe I should become a game writer.

quote: Original post by GalaxyQuest
I kind of like the Cleric/healer idea you gave. Imagine forming a team of wizards and clerics with one goal, to revert undead to living, to remove evil spirits in bodies, or to simply cast spells which send evil demons through a portal back to hell.

Weapons, you can still use weapons, but they are weapons of divinidy. Arrows with holly water which when they hit an evil spirit or undead, they begin to revert to a past "good" state.

I think this is exactly the kind of thing you need to avoid. Having enemies you "heal" instead of killing them, or weapons that "bless" instead of hurt is nothing but putting the same old thing into a new coat.

In the end this kind of redesign puts you in the exact same spot where you started. The game will essentially still be a murder-based experience gobbler, which I think is something we are trying to avoid here.

The point is not to simply substitute something else for the killing, but to find new challenges and new ways for the player to gather experience. This will invariably mean a lot more content, which will mean more work for the design department, but I think eventually this will be the only way.


Lets try and get away from this substitution idea and focus on real alternatives. IMO experience points (which will have to stay in some form or other) should be rewarded for every time the player character gains real experience (=did something that worked, learned something new, etc.), and then ONLY for the area the experience was gained in. This means that if you climbed a tree, you may have learnt something about climbing, if you talked a troll into giving you his lunch money, you may have learnt something about persuading trolls.

The problem that comes up with this is keeping the player from spending the first quarter of the game practising various stuff until he´s maxxed out, and only then beginning with the "real" game.

These are some of the worst ideas I''ve ever heard.
Just replacing killing to "hurting" or banishin the bad guy is stupid. If you took away the grahpics in diablo 2 how would you know what you''re really doing to the monster? or the square? you could be sexing them up for all you know.

And the other ideas.. like gaining experience for doing others stuff.. Hello?? Baldurs Gate, do you people even play RPG''s on the computer?

And what about Harvest Moon, isn''t that considered an RPG?

CrappySoft - game production team with a punk attitude. Mail me if you want to make levels, art etc.

Hey Moderator, is it my imagination or did one of my posts get deleted?

I like lower_case''s idea of going around sexing up the monsters. I''m not sure I''d play that game, but hey, to each their own.

And finally, on a more serious note...

In reply to Hase''s post, I think he makes a valid point of trying to think outside of just mere replacement. HOWEVER... we should also keep in mind that the games with situations like the one he describe already exist. They''re called "adventure games" and they''re not very popular at all right now. Of course, RPG games were in a big slump until Fallout and Baldur''s Gate revived the genre.

So.... is an adventure game merely an RPG without the fighting? I don''t think so, personally.

quote: Original post by Hase
I think some of you are going at this from the wrong angle. YOu´re trying to find substitutes for fighting, where substitutes are not necessary.

I agree. Wavinator once had a post about substitutes for fighting which were as repeatable and fun as fighting. I'd say the prime example is sneaking in the game Thief. sneaking was a repeatable action that was fun throughout the game much like fighting is in games and has a sense of danger too.



A CRPG in development...

Need help? Well, go FAQ yourself.

Edited by - Nazrix on October 10, 2001 7:23:32 PM

quote: Original post by Pyabo
HOWEVER... we should also keep in mind that the games with situations like the one he describe already exist. They''re called "adventure games" and they''re not very popular at all right now.

So.... is an adventure game merely an RPG without the fighting?

I disagree, what I describe does not really apply to the adventure games of today. Maybe that would be the ideal adventure game, but the ones I played in the last few years weren´t even close.

The problem with present adventure games is that they are almost completely linear.
Find object A for person B so you get object C which opens door D behind which is person E who gives you F for G to solve puzzle H in combination with object I, which you find at location X.....

The last real adventure I played was "The Longest Journey". Great graphics, great story, great voice acting (which you rarely find), simple and dull puzzles... no options.

If I am on a quest to save the world I don´t want to bother with finding the lost cat for the poor old man for which he will give me his magical armor. If I am so bloody important I will shake the old fart until he gives it to me, it´s not nice, but we are talking about the fate of the world, right?


And to the last point, I don´t think so either, but imo the "classical" adventure will die out sooner or later (too linear) and will be replaced by some in-between form. You don´t HAVE to have stats, you can have great, non-linear puzzle solving without them, but in some cases they are fun, the same goes for fighting.
So how about going into the direction of an adventure game with a) stats, b) some fights (c´mon, every good story has at least one fight), c) non-linear puzzle solving.
Lots of work? Sure, but then again I think this will be the only way for the genre to go.

D&D hack and slay will always have its fans, but I think that it´s not exactly a growing audience. The future markets lie with the unspoiled casual gamers, who aren´t as used to RPG-conventions as the hardcore gamers.

Harvest Moon (on snes and n64) is an rpg without killing.

Harvest Moon was released on Game Boy Color, as well.

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Omnipotent_Q
A guy at a community college with too much time on his hands.

quote: Original post by Pyabo
Hey Moderator, is it my imagination or did one of my posts get deleted?

I don''t remember deleting anything you''ve written, Pyabo. I''ve only moved off-topic posts, or deleted offensive posts.




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Just waiting for the mothership...