When the UK parliament will realize they could lose millions of workers they will lower the £35K limit.... That's the same kind of reason Swiss does not expels millions of non-Swiss workers..

Ah, but that depends on the population - immigration and population control was made a major factor in this campaign and has been for some time.

If the people still see it as a problem, and this assumes we even have control of the borders, then stopping people will be a requirement even if we are losing then as well... of course, that assumes people even want to come here still, right now regardless of how correct it is, the perception of many is the UK population doesn't want them here.

But then, I'm not sure I want to be here either... we'll see how it pans out before I make my choices...

I struggle to see any positive side to this result, it's more a question of how terrible it will turn out to be.

Wait until Merkel gives away visa-free travel to 75 million Turks. Then you'll thank Nigel on your knees...

Visa-free travel ( for short term visit ) isn't same as EU membership recklessly granted to latest member states. And UK has never been part of Schengen visa regime, so they were not affected at all of these "75 million Turks" horror story, all this "oh my God, Turks are coming" was complete nonsense for Brexit.

There will not be the flock/horde/run/invasion as expected if Turks get visa-free travel , but if it will make you happy Turkish president is trying to blackmail EU so it may not even be possible in short/mid term.

That's pretty naive. Merkel invites them, and then they end up in the UK. And Erdogan is winning his blackmail, so Merkel will keep giving in, to the point of Turkey joining the EU.

Luckily every other country will leave, so Merkel and Erdogan can be happy together.

It's no secret that this visa-free issue has been brought to light because of Syrian refugees crisis (that EU couldn't care less before it comes to own borders) , still it's not logical to say that they will end up in UK when this free travel doesn't cover UK.

And I see no problem in Turkey joining EU in case of completing homework which seems to be taking few centuries in this pace unless Erdo?an and his mentality is removed from office. I think Merkel is playing smart but dealing with ridiculous reactions, once Syrian crisis is over they will not care about Erdo?an's Turkey as they did for over a year.

"Mr" Erdogan is the last man that EU needs at all. Well, "Mr" Erdogan is that kind of man that the entire worlds do not needs too.

Nothing against Turkish people...

Currently, I don't think Turkey meets the requirements for EU membership. I don't think that is likely to change so long as Erdogan is in charge.

Once they do, I wouldn't really have a problem with it. The way Turkey's membership has been talked up and exaggerated by the Leave campaign is just an example of how they appeal to the racist elements in society.

ChaosEngine, on 24 Jun 2016 - 08:54 AM, said:
Fucking idiots. A campaign based on racism, fear and ignorance.

It was based on democracy and independence. People didn't like Merkel telling them what to do. It's not that 51% of the country's racist...

Unfortunately... no.. it wasn't really.

There was a LOT of fear mongering and dishonesty (for example, see £350m/week BS) on both sides, with a health dose of 'immigrants are the problem' thrown in... it was not a campaign based on facts or balanced arguments.

The population has been primed for this for some time too; the press is very right leaning and for the last 10 or more years we've had a near constant narrative of "EU is the enemy!", "Immigrants are terrible!" and the image of the plucky Brit vs the big bad EU... and for many people this will have driven their desire to leave.

So while 51% of the country isn't racist, a proportion is (reports of a guy standing outside a school with a high Muslim population making victory signs at the parents, or the terrorist who murdered the MP last week) and some where pushed in that direction by news stories for years, combined with fear campaigns about countries joining the EU which implied there were about to join and that 4 million people would becoming to the UK right away.

(We also had the fun of the 'leave' campaign using images of people who weren't in favour of leave to prop up their side... in one case the person in question took to facebook to point out it was used without his permission, and that he was 'just about in' and got utterly torn to pieces in the comments... not the people who misused his image, no, that was fine, but his saying otherwise? tear him down!)

There was, in this mess of bullshit, good reasons on both sides to vote either way, I've had good and productive discussion with people at work on the subject who could state their case without racism entering in to it, but that was rarely heard - both sides tried to BS their way to the result they wanted.

And then we have cockwombles who've said today "I voted leave, but I didn't think we'd leave, so I didn't think my vote would matter and now I'm really worried"... one such person having been interviewed on the BBC.. which is basically "I normally vote Labour but I voted Tory because I feared an Labour + SNP coalition" all over again. Don't get me wrong, I won't have a go at someone for voting "out", but jesus Christ how thick do you have to be to do that?!?

So lets not try and make out this was some high class debate; it was nasty and it will have left lasting scars across communities and families... in one case one family has lost their mother because of the nastiness which has been brought up. (Despite the 'revolution without a shot fired' quote attributed to Farage...)

A rise of nationalism in Europe must be a good thing right? *thinks back to last century*

Although truth be told, everything else aside the EU imo isn't the best functioning entity in the world. Again, imo, the EU strongly resembles a confederacy, which historically have never really been successful. Brexit in the short term will cause turmoil, simply because it's upsetting an the status quo, but England isn't exactly some backwater, so I'm sure they'll come out alright.

That being said though, the rising tides of nationalism are a bit disconcerting.

ChaosEngine, on 24 Jun 2016 - 08:54 AM, said:
Fucking idiots. A campaign based on racism, fear and ignorance.

It was based on democracy and independence. People didn't like Merkel telling them what to do. It's not that 51% of the country's racist...

Unfortunately... no.. it wasn't really.

There was a LOT of fear mongering and dishonesty (for example, see £350m/week BS) on both sides, with a health dose of 'immigrants are the problem' thrown in... it was not a campaign based on facts or balanced arguments.

The population has been primed for this for some time too; the press is very right leaning and for the last 10 or more years we've had a near constant narrative of "EU is the enemy!", "Immigrants are terrible!" and the image of the plucky Brit vs the big bad EU... and for many people this will have driven their desire to leave.

So while 51% of the country isn't racist, a proportion is (reports of a guy standing outside a school with a high Muslim population making victory signs at the parents, or the terrorist who murdered the MP last week) and some where pushed in that direction by news stories for years, combined with fear campaigns about countries joining the EU which implied there were about to join and that 4 million people would becoming to the UK right away.

(We also had the fun of the 'leave' campaign using images of people who weren't in favour of leave to prop up their side... in one case the person in question took to facebook to point out it was used without his permission, and that he was 'just about in' and got utterly torn to pieces in the comments... not the people who misused his image, no, that was fine, but his saying otherwise? tear him down!)

There was, in this mess of bullshit, good reasons on both sides to vote either way, I've had good and productive discussion with people at work on the subject who could state their case without racism entering in to it, but that was rarely heard - both sides tried to BS their way to the result they wanted.

And then we have cockwombles who've said today "I voted leave, but I didn't think we'd leave, so I didn't think my vote would matter and now I'm really worried"... one such person having been interviewed on the BBC.. which is basically "I normally vote Labour but I voted Tory because I feared an Labour + SNP coalition" all over again. Don't get me wrong, I won't have a go at someone for voting "out", but jesus Christ how thick do you have to be to do that?!?

So lets not try and make out this was some high class debate; it was nasty and it will have left lasting scars across communities and families... in one case one family has lost their mother because of the nastiness which has been brought up. (Despite the 'revolution without a shot fired' quote attributed to Farage...)

I've been reading about this and it's quite disconcerting to see any of this in a country like England. It's scary imo.

Also on a side note, anyone realize that Independence Day: Resurgence came out today, the same day as Brexit? Thought I'd leave that tidbit here :P

Also on a side note, anyone realize that Independence Day: Resurgence came out today, the same day as Brexit? Thought I'd leave that tidbit here :P

Well... Some people are just too much dramatic... But it's time that people take on the responsibility of their choices. How many people in UK did not vote?

I struggle to see any positive side to this result, it's more a question of how terrible it will turn out to be.

Wait until Merkel gives away visa-free travel to 75 million Turks. Then you'll thank Nigel on your knees...

Is there a particular reason why? Or is this just racism and fearmongering? Bear in mind I actually live in an area which has quite a large number of turkish immigrants.

And how is that working out for where you live? All those Turkish immigrants do, is maybe open a Kebab or Doner shop, or else collect welfare. Their women don't work, and their children terrorize schools and neighborhoods...

Working out very well where I am in Canada. We have several long running and highly popular restaurants run by very hard working families from that region. I've found the immigrants from around there to be very productive members of local society, and are active in a wide range of industries. Their families are polite and friendly, and host wonderful dinner parties.

It is kind of amazing just how well humans get along when they're invited to be part of a group to work together toward common goals, rather than being shunned and excluded.