@way2lazy2care
Though this was not actually formed as a question, I did intend it to be one:

If we don't both agree to the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights, (in this case §2 and §18 http://en.wikisource...of_Human_Rights) then yes you're right.

Do you hold deity higher than human rights? It's a very specific question, but I would like to know if we have any common world view of right and wrong, or if we're just missing each others points.

Do you hold deity higher than human rights? It's a very specific question, but I would like to know if we have any common world view of right and wrong, or if we're just missing each others points.

Human rights as defined by humans would be quite a bit different than human rights as defined by humanity's creator don't you think

edit: I didn't read the rest of your quote to get the context of that till just now. You are totally free to do whatever you want. That doesn't mean you should be excused from the consequences.

Think of God as a guy with a really nice house and we are all born covered in mud. God says as long as you're a generally nice person, not dirty and you won't mess up his house you're more than welcome to come in. He even tells you how to clean yourself up. When you show up at his door you're dirty but a generally nice person. God says, "Go clean yourself up and you can come in," and you say, "nah I don't want to clean up. I'm good all covered in mud. now let me in. Not letting me in would be cruel. Forcing me to be clean to come into your house is totally against human rights. Just let me in."

Why do you think murderers and rapists go to heaven without repenting in the first place?

Forgive me, but I was kind of under the impression that the way to salvation was through the belief and acceptance that Jesus died as our savior, not through repentance? So you can rape, murder do whatever despicable and sinful things you like, but so long as you believe Jesus died on that cross to cleanse all of our sins, you're good to go. On the other hand you can lead the kind of life which Jesus was a great proponent of (love thy neighbor, judge not, do violence to no man, live peaceably with all men etc. etc.) and burn in hell because you didn't believe that he died as our savior.

Forgive me, but I was kind of under the impression that the way to salvation was through the belief and acceptance that Jesus died as our savior, not through repentance? So you can rape, murder do whatever despicable and sinful things you like, but so long as you believe Jesus died on that cross to cleanse all of our sins, you're good to go. On the other hand you can lead the kind of life which Jesus was a great proponent of (love thy neighbor, judge not, do violence to no man, live peaceably with all men etc. etc.) and burn in hell because you didn't believe that he died as our savior.

Well you were under the wrong impression if that's what you thought the majority of christians believe.

Well you were under the wrong impression if that's what you thought the majority of christians believe.

Oh yeah?...

[font="sans-serif"]While various Christian denominations debate Christian theology and specifics, individual acknowledgement and acceptance of Christ as one's Savior is generally mandated or defined as the "key" to Christian salvation.[/font]
[font="sans-serif"][/quote][/font]

[quote name='way2lazy2care' timestamp='1311093427' post='4837479']
Well you were under the wrong impression if that's what you thought the majority of christians believe.

Oh yeah?...

[font="sans-serif"]While various Christian denominations debate Christian theology and specifics, individual acknowledgement and acceptance of Christ as one's Savior is generally mandated or defined as the "key" to Christian salvation.[/font]
[font="sans-serif"][/quote][/font]
[/quote]

did you read your whole link?

Why are we even discussing consequences of stories that have no scientific value and no evidence to support them?
Why not discuss Greek Mythology? It's a more interesting and less bloody that Christian Mythology anyways :-)

In study after study there is found a clear and consistent connection between a lower IQ and religiosity. It is, therefore, no more wise to try to prove to Believers that they're wrong than it is to try to prove to a chimpanzee that eating one's own shit should be avoided.

In study after study there is found a clear and consistent connection between a lower IQ and religiosity.

Curiously I've checked it. At least some studies support your claim. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religiosity_and_intelligence#Studies_comparing_religious_belief_and_I.Q

In study after study there is found a clear and consistent connection between a lower IQ and religiosity. It is, therefore, no more wise to try to prove to Believers that they're wrong than it is to try to prove to a chimpanzee that eating one's own shit should be avoided.

Seriously dude. Is it beyond your capability to refer to people as human adults rather than comparing them to delusional shit eating monkeys? You're coming from the side of the argument that is generally easier to argue and acting like a child is doing the argument no favors.