Quote: Original post by HostileExpanse
.....like some sort of mixed economy? Intriguing!

But, what foolhardy society will be bold enough to take on such a radical endeavor?

Don't be a fool, what you're describing is COMMUNISM. It's clear to me that you have no understanding of FREEDOM. I'm sorry, I thought this was AMERICA??

I for one am willing to double my healthcare costs in order to make sure that poor people don't get any. At the end of the day, if Jesus wanted poor people to have access to health care, then he would have instituted it when he founded the United States of AMERICA.

Besides which, if people wanted health care that much, then they would have been born into a middle class family like me.

^^

My day. You have made it.

Only A Lobbyist-Funded Mob Would Chant "What's Wrong With Profit?"

Quote: Original post by Mithrandir
Sarah Palin says Obama would have killed Trig.

There goes Sarah Palin again, inserting her family into politics and complaining when people make fun of her for it. You know we've entered bizarroland when the fascists parade themselves as anti-fascists. Don't Cry For Me Alaska!

Everything is for profit or personal gain. The question is how best to manage this. The idea that socializing health care eliminates this is a fantasy. The wealthy capitalist class that socialists are so bitterly jealous of will continue to get the best possible coverage for themselves and their progeny while everyone else will deal with "friendly", "efficient", government employees who neither care about profit or your health. The capitalists will find a way to profit from all the loop holes and silly requirements sprinkled throughout the massive 1000-page health care bill.

I was told that one of the proposed versions of the bill contained language that said information had to be provided in a "culturally appropriate" manner, or some such nonsense like that. Queue the "culturally-aware communications consultants" :)

Yeah right. Criticisms of a failing system can't possibly be based on facts, it's got to be jealousy! That's the only possible explanation why people might be angry with a system that costs twice as much and delivers half the bang! It's all about class envy!!!

This is reminding me of the time I had to phone the SOCIALIZEINIZED fire department when one of the wall sockets in my house burst into flames. I had to spend two hours talking to some bureaucrat on the phone to get them to send out a fire engine, because the fact that it was SOCIALIZEINIZED there was some automatically some kind of SOCIALIZEINIZEINIZEINIZED bureaucrat in between me and my fire department. In the end I burned to death because of socialism.

If you think a socialized fire department could work, you're living in a fairy tale.

Quote: Original post by trzy
Everything is for profit or personal gain. The question is how best to manage this. The idea that socializing health care eliminates this is a fantasy. The wealthy capitalist class that socialists are so bitterly jealous of will continue to get the best possible coverage for themselves and their progeny while everyone else will deal with "friendly", "efficient", government employees who neither care about profit or your health. The capitalists will find a way to profit from all the loop holes and silly requirements sprinkled throughout the massive 1000-page health care bill.

I don't know, the UK seems to manage fine, and manages to offer a fantastic quality of care. For reference, my place of work offers health insurance as an optional benefit, but I've not bothered to claim it, because the NHS is perfectly adequate. Having dated a nurse, I can tell you that staff under our godless COMMUNIST system most definitely do care about the wellbeing of patients.

I don't see how the worlds only superpower can fail to do something that pretty much every other first world country has managed to do. Even if the government did fail to provide the same level of care as other countries, I fail to see how this is worse than being absolutely fucked and not being able to get health care at all, or ending up $400K in debt from medical bills.

Quote: Original post by trzy
I was told that...

Is it true?

You have a reaction and a criticism based on "what you were told." The bill itself is publicly available; you can read it. You can even ask the person who told you such a thing to give you the page on which the excerpt occurred, so you could confirm it yourself without having to read the whole proposal. But you didn't. And the people who tell such things know that the fools who listen to them won't read the source material, but they'll get out there and rage anyway.

You are what is wrong with America.

Quote: Original post by Stab-o-tron
I don't see how the worlds only superpower can fail to do something that pretty much every other first world country has managed to do. Even if the government did fail to provide the same level of care as other countries, I fail to see how this is worse than being absolutely fucked and not being able to get health care at all, or ending up $400K in debt from medical bills.

Um, excuse me? That "debt" is someone else's profit, and far be it from us permitting you to get away without rendering every last penny - just as the Founding Fathers intended!

</sarcasm>, for the slow.

Quote: Original post by Stab-o-tron
This is reminding me of the time I had to phone the SOCIALIZEINIZED fire department when one of the wall sockets in my house burst into flames. I had to spend two hours talking to some bureaucrat on the phone to get them to send out a fire engine, because the fact that it was SOCIALIZEINIZED there was some automatically some kind of SOCIALIZEINIZEINIZEINIZED bureaucrat in between me and my fire department. In the end I burned to death because of socialism.

If you think a socialized fire department could work, you're living in a fairy tale.

So because fire departments, which have long been the province of local governments, work, everything the government does will work? What are you, a communist?

Quote: I don't know, the UK seems to manage fine, and manages to offer a fantastic quality of care.

Is it as good as it could be? Or for that matter, as good as it should be? Some evidence suggests not. And as for managing this unremarkable system, I'll concede that Britain does a fine job, except possibly in the area of finances, which I understand are in quite a shambles.

Quote: Having dated a nurse, I can tell you that staff under our godless COMMUNIST system most definitely do care about the wellbeing of patients.

I know people working for the for-profit medical system we have here who also care about the well-being of patients. What of it?

Quote:
I don't see how the worlds only superpower can fail to do something that pretty much every other first world country has managed to do. Even if the government did fail to provide the same level of care as other countries, I fail to see how this is worse than being absolutely fucked and not being able to get health care at all, or ending up $400K in debt from medical bills.

I think you put too much faith in our government. No wonder the British were so quick to hitch a ride with us to Iraq and Afghanistan! But in all seriousness, our system needs effective reform to bring costs down and allow patients more choice of providers. Tackling the insurance companies and tort reform are vital.