I can see both sides of the issue here, and it''s a system that really screws everybody around in the long run. (I fit into the "would really love to design games but doesn''t give a crap about programming and is probably too lazy to finish anything anyway" category myself, btw. )

Sure, game companies wanna make money. From the disappointed aspiring game designer''s point of view this is evil and they should let anyone who thinks they can make a game try their best and get paid for it. From the company''s point of view, why hire some guy who they have no idea whether he can actually do what he says he can, and risk losing money when he fails to live up to his self-promotion?

I can''t really think of a solution here, but I wonder what''d happen if they instituted apprenticeships or something? They teach you what you need to know, you provide a steady stream of ideas. If it works out you get an actual job, if not there''s plenty of other aspiring game designers out there they can choose from.

(Note that I don''t know much about how the industry actually works so I''m probably being incredibly unrealistic, but hey I can''t let a controversial thread go on TOO long without sticking my nose into it. )

Haven''t read all the posts so I may be repeating what someone else may have already stated.

First off, game development has become a pretty serious industry. Like other serious industries, you have to prove yourself if you want to be in that industry.

There are scores of people per square inch that want to be in game development. What sets you apart from these other people? I don''t want to get you down... as a matter of fact, I''d like to see your positive spirit grow into something productive. Before you can do anything, you HAVE to do something productive. I think it''s easier now than ever to get _started_ in game development, however, this increases the competition as well. What can you do that the next guy can''t? Just for a laugh, look up Kingpinz in this forum! Hehehehehe (okay, so that is probably WRONG on a lotta levels, but you''ll at least see that a lot of people out there have "ideas"). The question is: Can you make these ideas WORK?!

Do you have an incredible (in your opinion) game idea? Have you created this world in a 3D editor? Perhaps, you aren''t a 3D artist. Have you programmed examples of your world to prove your theories? Are you an artist and have drawn out this world along with a story board?

Everyone has ideas. I have ideas that I think are ground-breaking... but ya know what? I haven''t implemented them fully as of yet. Therefore, they are worth NOTHING! I am willing to accept that my ideas are useless. However, if I complete the implementation in some way, THEN and only then have I accomplished something.

Work hard if you want this but never lose the spirit =)

- Jay


[ Here, taste this ]

quote: Original post by onyxflame
I can''t really think of a solution here, but I wonder what''d happen if they instituted apprenticeships or something? They teach you what you need to know, you provide a steady stream of ideas.

Apprenticeships? Yeah, that''d be nice wouldn''t it? How about CEO apprenticeships too? Hehehehe

Like a CEO, a game designer is being trusted for his ideas and efficiency (and ability) for execution. A game designer is trusted to deliver what the public wants and gain their support. Can you do that? I doubt if I can (would like to find out though).

I''m pretty much focused on web development these days Haven''t read all the posts so I may be repeating what someone else may have already stated.

First off, game development has become a pretty serious industry. Like other serious industries, you have to prove yourself if you want to be in that industry.

There are scores of people per square inch that want to be in game development. What sets you apart from these other people? I don''t want to get you down... as a matter of fact, I''d like to see your positive spirit grow into something productive. Before you can do anything, you HAVE to do something productive. I think it''s easier now than ever to get _started_ in game development, however, this increases the competition as well. What can you do that the next guy can''t? Just for a laugh, look up Kingpinz in this forum! Hehehehehe (okay, so that is probably WRONG on a lotta levels, but you''ll at least see that a lot of people out there have "ideas"). The question is: Can you make these ideas WORK?!

Do you have an incredible (in your opinion) game idea? Have you created this world in a 3D editor? Perhaps, you aren''t a 3D artist. Have you programmed examples of your world to prove your theories? Are you an artist and have drawn out this world along with a story board?

Everyone has ideas. I have ideas that I think are ground-breaking... but ya know what? I haven''t implemented them fully as of yet. Therefore, they are worth NOTHING! I am willing to accept that my ideas are useless. However, if I complete the implementation in some way, THEN and only then have I accomplished something.

- Jay


[ Here, taste this ]

I''ve been playing a certain mud for 3+ years and during that time have come up with many ideas which the coders decided to put into the game, does that count? (Note that they''ve wanted me on their staff for ages, but I''ve so far refused to take the plunge because then it stops being fun and starts being a job. )

i havent read much of the above... but if youre wanting in the game designing world, try making Mod''s for Quake or Half Life, or games like that...a lot of game-biz people started off making mods

quote: Original post by coderx75 Everyone has ideas. I have ideas that I think are ground-breaking... but ya know what? I haven''t implemented them fully as of yet. Therefore, they are worth NOTHING!

I hate it when people claim that ideas aren''t worth anything. That is simply false. Ideas are scattered throughout every game and often evolve in the making, affecting each game''s design in all sorts of important ways.

Just look at how game developers are constantly borrowing ideas from other games. Why would they do that if ideas had no value? Or look at the number of clones made by indie developers. Why do so many clones exist if not because of the scarcity of original and effective ideas?

I''ll be the first to admit that game ideas have little to no market value, but to say they have no value at all is just silly. Given the pervasiveness of ideas - subtle and not so subtle - in any game design, the fact that ideas are very valuable cannot be denied.

I don''t even LIKE Quake et al, so why would I wanna make stuff for them? The closest I''ve ever gotten is recoloring some Sims items for my mom but that got boring pretty fast. (Was pretty funny when we had a chair that from one direction it was green but from another it was purple... )

For me, most of the game specific editors are too constricting for me to enjoy editing and coming up with something interesting (though don''t get me wrong, I haven''t even had a chance to mess with any of the FPS editors, only C&C/Warcraft/Simcity 3K editors ). Editors are a great idea though, I just think they should give an aspiring editor enough freedom to be creative without forcing them to a predetermined set of pieces to play with.

I''m planning on doing some editors for the games I''m designing, mostly to give some idealistic freedom to the players, but also to allow chance design types to have a crack at being creative for a purpose

quote:
A game designer is trusted to deliver what the public wants and gain their support. Can you do that?

Yes, I have, and it didn''t even take fancy graphics or even a demo, just pure, solid, player focused content :D

(ok, so the concept drawings helped some, but that was mainly the fighting game though, not the other dozen games )

After all, they are the reasons why game will sell, so why not make sure you focus on what players feed on?

(Nothing like having people want to pre-order a game you haven''t made yet )

- Chris

OMFG! I HAVE STARTED A FL4M3W4R!!~
w00t!