Just because you go to college doesn''t guarantee you''ll learn the material. One needs to apply him or herself. If you choose a degree you''re not really interested in, probably you won''t spend much time on it.

One should also look at the schools facilities. Some colleges are better equipped than others. Those that are better equipped (libraries, computers, professors, etc.) offer more opportunities than others. Some small schools lack the strength in faculty to teach various interesting courses. Professors in small schools sometimes get stuck teaching courses they aren''t really qualified or interested in teaching. Ack!

Anyway, I''ll be sitting in Algorithms, Network Security, and Databases, this summer... how many schools offer those courses in the summer? I''m not a CS guy either. Hey, I could just get a book and read the material myself, but it helps sometimes when a professor guides you with his experiences and style (sometimes it hinders, but not from my experience). Plus, you can ask questions, much like we do here. Grades also provide a motivation to learn, but sometimes the opposite happens unfortunately.

I am 21 years old and I work for a large busines, writting data bases and other boring crap. After I finished high school I never had the chance, not the money to go to univ/college, so instead I graduated from programming school (career education).
I don''t "love" my job, yet it pays very well, but I''d rather be working for westwood/originturbine etc., creating games.
Anyways back to the topic of higher education. I am looking to the day when I can stop working as much as right now I complete a degree in CS and mathematics. You see I can live without one, but for once I''d like to get a more "fun" job.
Other uses for a degree:
1. Easier time finding a job.
2. You can hang it on the wall
3. You can show it to your kids
4. YYou can go for masters and PhD eventually

Remember if your parents are willing to pay your college just go.

Regards
the prima donna aka Graves

***Stand and Deliver***

OK I''m note sure about anyone else here but I have NO collage degree and make more money then my Degree ridden talentless coworkers! I have been contracting for a little over 5 years and in the last 3.5 years have far exceeded any salary amount of any coworker by far. The original question was is collage necessary.. The answer is "it depends upon you!" Are you a self-started? Are you dedicated? Do you want to be the best? I have met many employees that become that for "Job Security". Corporations hire me because I solve complex problems in a short time. That is why I get paid$$$$! For me I had low self-confidence and then joined the USMC. I exited the Marine Corps with superior attitude and went to "College" It was slow and at least 6 - 12 months behind in technology so I dropped out. I spent every penny I have on software and books and have made money ever since! The fact is if you have the Drive and Dedication you can have a tremendous impact on any corporation you go to and have money to retire early!
Remember only you can make yourself successful! Work hard and you WILL be rewarded

I don''t know if this was said previously , but why don''t you go to art school AND try to get a job. That way you can have the best of both worlds if you are too impatient to finish school.

BTW, I would seriously recommend college (although there is still 1 more year until I go).

-Icarus

quote: Original post by Possibility

One thing no one has mentioned is the cost of college. If you go to college, it is gonna require 5 yrs of your life and put you $10,000-$20,000 in debt.

$10,000-$20,000??? Just to go to a college? Poor guys...

Im in the 3th year of my Computer Engineering study at University. Here in Denmark we get PAID to study. Denmark has this wonderfull thing called ''Educational Support'' (or something like that) and I receive around $150-200 a month from the state. Just because Im studying.

Come to Denmark and get a degree ;-)

Regards

nicba

Nicba, nobody cares about the free college most europeans get. In America, we have to pay through the nose for it, and it usually requires taking out Federal loans to do it.

Fredric: "How do you garauntee the person with no degree gets a job? Unless hell froze over, there would be college graduates applying for the same job right when that person with no degree is applying. Thus, this really shoots the shit out of your theory."

Where have you been hiding Fredric. If you havent noticed, there is far more demand for computer programmers then there computer programmers. The latest report I looked at I beleive said over 40% of computer programming posititions available go unfilled! If you go to basically any games web site, you will see that the game developers are hiring.

So the demand is out there. If you know how to progam, and you have produced a good demo reel of your work, and your work is good. You will be hired. It might take you slightly longer to get a job compared to the college graduate. But you may also be younger him, so in escence, even if it takes you 2 months to longer to find a job, you will still have found one a few years before him.

What I basically mean is, if you have started programming at age 15, and you have the ambition to sit down and learn on your own. Then get a few programming books, and learn the stuff well. By the time your 18, you should really know what you are doing, and can probably get a decent paying job.

It all depends on your demo reel. If you can develope a quake3 quality engine, you will get a damn good paying job with almost any company even if your 14 years old.

Also, if you can get a job right away, why deprive your self of that? Take the job, and if the company doesnt reward skill, but rather only rewards you for your education -- exp, you have no college degree but get paid less then the other guy there who has one, but you do more work and better work. then leave the company nad look for another job. And that job you just had will still look damn good on a resume. Job experience can be more beneficial then just a college degree.

Or as someone most obviously pointed out, do both college and programming job at same time.

Possibility
P.S. Boy did i just blab on and on and on and on and on and on...

Go to college! It teaches you things you couldn''t have possibly taught yourself at home, such as

-Working in a team. (most often you will work in groups on small projects)
-Planning.
-Discipline.
I can imagine when you learn at home you only teach yourself the things you want to learn, not neccesarily what is needed to be learned.
-Working under a deadline.

Furthermore, it will give you a guarantee for the company that you can do what you say you can do, thus being a lower risk for the company. (I can guarantee you that this increases your chances of getting a job with atleast 50%)

Second, you say you like learning yourself better than in a classroom. Well, most of the time you will be in a classroom learning yourself, with the teacher to help you when you need him.

And ofcourse you''ll learn things that are not directly relevant to becoming an artist, but can come in handy anyway, such as Sociology, economy, and marketing, communication.

And (at least with me) you get at least a year of work experience, so that won''t be a problem.

Depending on what you want to go into - College IS a necessity. I want to become a Graphics Researcher, an OFFICIAL one, and that means attaining a PhD. You can''t do that without first going through college.
( I''ve got my MSc already, I''m in my first year of doing the PhD ).

In the industry, if you are good enough, you can get by without. The only problem is that you will be highly specialised, and the field you are specialised in might dry up, leaving you with nowhere to go. College will force you to learn things that aren''t as fun, or interesting, but may turn out useful if your career makes an unexpected turn.

For instance, as a self-taught coder, you might be in real trouble if your skills got you promoted to manager level in your company, because you won''t have had backgrounder courses in economics and project management. You might learn these on your own, but in the end you''ll have the equivalent of a college education, without the oh-so-important piece of paper at the end.

Now, I do realise cost is a HUGE factor in the USA, over here in Europe governments are wiser and make it next to free. With an amount of debt like those you get in the USA after University, I''d think twice about going as well!


#pragma DWIM // Do What I Mean!
~ Mad Keith ~
**I use Software Mode**

Yeah, here college is really cheap, but that also makes people do absolutely not a shit at school. I bet there wouldn''t be as much dropouts at my school if their parents/themselves should pay through the nose for it.
But hey, anything to create equal chances huh?

You can look at it any way you want to nowadays, but frankly base your decision on going through some of the Employment ads for companies. I think you''ll find that about 99% of jobs you''ll want begin with "BS in Computer Sci. required".
Don''t see many ads these days based on how good you are and what you''re capable of....that happens in the interview process....which you will almost never get to if your resume is tossed for not meeting requirements.
Sure people have worked their way up in industries, but that goes with not just hard work and talents, it also needs many connections and favors. So basically the ''institutionalist'' mentality you are trying to avoid comes back at you x4.
Anything you can get for your resume, DO it. I cannot stress this enough. Intern, study, do independant projects.
Go for it man. Your life will thank you