What are your general feelings on hex based games? I'm referring to what are essentially turn based war simulations, similar to Panzer General, Star General and Fantasy General by SSI from a number of years ago. I haven't seen any war simulations like that in quite some time, and I'm wondering if attempting to bring them back is even worth the effort. We have a project along these lines that is started, but I just want some feedback as to whether or not it is worth taking it to completion. We're kind of at the point where if we press on, we're going to be sinking a lot of time and resources into the project. If we decide not to, then that's ok too because we haven't wasted too much and it has been a useful experience. So, back to the question at hand, what do you think of hex based games and why? What do you like, what do you dislike, etc. Looking for an honest video game publisher? Visit www.gamethoughts.com [edited by - mtaber on August 2, 2002 12:10:39 PM]

The good:
Hex based games tend to offer more lifelike movement.

The bad:
Hex based games can''t be controlled using the number pad.

Well, I was referring to turn based hex games where it lays out all acceptable places for your unit to go and automatically calculates whether it can get there or not. So, you click on your unit, click on the desination, and that''s it. No in-between steps, so you don''t need to use the number pad. Wouldn''t you rather use the mouse?

Looking for an honest video game publisher? Visit www.gamethoughts.com

Hex-based games do have their place, but usually it''s as an adaptation of a board game of some type. It usually works out well for World War II games because most of the board gamers that like World War II also play the board games, which are almost all hex-based.

I really hope that World In Flames (Australian Design Group) gets it''s adaptation over to computer finished soon because I think that is one of the more thorough war games out there.

Anyway, I think that the market is out there, but it''s really a niche market and you''ve got to do it well or you''ll just earn their ire. I think that this is what happened with the last Panzer General game, it departed from the traditional hex-based game style (directly overhead) and tried something new (3/4 view). It just didn''t feel... right.

If you do it right though, every last one of us old-style board gamers will buy it right up

I downloaded a free hex-based wargame recently, and it was just WAY too complicated. Hundreds of stats everywhere with little explanation of what they meant. And the company wondered why it wasn''t selling many copies...

So to me, the idea of a hex-based turn-based war game is fine, providing it has decent in-game help, maybe with a tutorial mode, and can ease you into it. The in-game help could include things like tooltips, a status bar telling you what you''re doing and what you can validly click on, an in-game reference like the Civilopedia in Civilization, etc.

[ MSVC Fixes | STL | SDL | Game AI | Sockets | C++ Faq Lite | Boost | Asking Questions | Organising code files ]

Some of my favorite war games are hex-based. I think it is a fine approach, but probably difficult for commercial profitability.

Square tiles are easier to make, but diagonal movement is skewed. Hex always retains that annoying hip-hopping up and down when moving against the grain of the grid, but diagonals are much better.

It is the rest of the ideas and graphics that will have the greater impact on the game''s success. My vote is for non-historically representative games. Simple but balanced.

I would like to hear more about it.

CDV

are you doing this for profit or for fun? If you are doing it for the former, I''d say it''s not worth it...but if you are doing it for the latter, by all means go ahead.

I don''t think too many people would like turn based hex games, no matter the polish or the gameplay features. Like Kylotan said, most wargame style simulations are far too arcane for the average and casual gamer. Even with lots of in-game help, I think that your mass-market gamer simply doesn''t have the attention span to take the time required to invest in the learning curve of games like this. It''s sort of like trying to get the younger generation to read books....why read static rusty pages when you can watch a movie on the subject? Why play chess when you can play vid games? IT''s just not...well, attractive enough.

However, I for one love games like that. I think it requires a lot of forethought and planning, and is not something you just jump into with two feet. I think that''s something that needs to be addressed as a whole with gaming, but for me, the enjoyable things in life are the things that don''t come too easy. When you invest your time into something, you appreciate it more really.

But I digress. If you like those kinds of games and want to do it as a hobby, good luck on your endeavours If however you want to do this as a money making project, I think you should reconsider, or at least have realistic expectations of how many people would like games like that.

Thanks, that''s the kind of input I was looking for. I was planning on doing this for both profit and fun. Whether I am putting more emphasis on fun or profit, I haven''t come to a conclusion yet. I just see a total lack of those kinds of games in the market. I realize that one of the limitations I''m going to run into is attracting people to that style of game.

I don''t have the expectations of attracting people from an RTS to a hex turn based game, but I was just kind of wondering what kind of interest is out there for seeing a new one, one that is done right and designed from the start with the fun factor in mind and not the ''me too'' attitude of some game publishers.

But what I would expect is to draw the hard core gamers who are fans of those type of war sims. Obviously tutorials and in-game help would be included. I have no intentions of doing anything like a 3/4 view that they tried in Panzer general, but I do have plans for what I think is a decent twist on the typical turn based game.

If anyone else has any ideas, feel free to post them. I''d like to hear them. I plan on proceeding with the development. I''m sure you''ll hear more from me on this in a few months.

Looking for an honest video game publisher? Visit www.gamethoughts.com

quote: Original post by Dauntless
Like Kylotan said, most wargame style simulations are far too arcane for the average and casual gamer. Even with lots of in-game help, I think that your mass-market gamer simply doesn''t have the attention span to take the time required to invest in the learning curve of games like this.
...
However, I for one love games like that.

I thought I loved games like that! But it had just too high a learning curve, as you said. And it seemed to expect that I knew the difference between 7 different kinds of German tank just by name. I''m not saying to take out the historical accuracy, but some sort of in-game reference to help me know the difference would have been great. I just fired up The Ardennes Offensive and all it gives you is a sea of abbreviations and icons - and that was the tutorial scenario.

I expect there are probably a lot of people like me, who are willing to give such a game a try, especially if you have a free demo with a single scenario available for download. But without significant steps to ease someone like me into the game, I won''t buy it.