Programmer71 said:
Exactly , but the answer I get the most of the times is that they want unity or unreal, probably to modify the code to their likening

Ah--that's quite a different thing, then, I feel!

I imagine that for the publisher it comes down to risk: a home-made engine incurs a higher risk than a third-party one, and thus increases the overall risk associated with the project.

(For one thing, a home-made engine will, I daresay, likely have been used by fewer developers and thus had less field-testing.)

As to Unity and Unreal, is Unity's code open-source?

I would be inclined to suspect that it's more likely to do with developer uptake and the teams behind the engines: To the former, with lots of games made using those engines, they're proven, and thus of lower risk. To the latter, the teams have been developing and supporting those engines for some time now, and thus again there may be a perception of there being less risk of support for the engine becoming defunct.

I agree totally with your point of view, but, in the very next future, there will be no more experts on 3d, there are going to be lots and lots of unreal and unity ‘engineers’ , the market will saturate and people will accept job for less and less , until something happens. Recently I have read that Unity got into a partnership with a company specialized in microtransactions, this company in the past createed the installcore app, expect a lot of unwanted bloatware with newer unity versions.

Programmer71 said:
… but, in the very next future, there will be no more experts on 3d …

I imagine that engines such as Unity and Unreal (and others, of course) will still provide a demand for such experts--as perhaps will those developers that stick with their own engines, Conversely, there will likely still be those who are interested in developing for the field. Thus I don't expect there to be a problematic lack.

I do imagine that it's true that there will be fewer such experts--but that's okay. With the medium moving away from myriad bespoke engines and frameworks, fewer experts (but not none) are called for.

Programmer71 said:
… the market will saturate and people will accept job for less and less …

This might be a problem--there is a boom in indie development, and while I do like that more and more people are able to create their art, I do worry a little about the market. We'll see, I suppose!

Programmer71 said:
Recently I have read that Unity got into a partnership with a company specialized in microtransactions …

I think that I heard about this, and indeed, it did seem troubling.

Perhaps devs will start to migrate to other engines.

Programmer71 said:
expect a lot of unwanted bloatware with newer unity versions.

Thankfully, and speaking only for myself, I don't actually use Unity these days.

until something happens

When the unity version from 2028 will only run with 128 gbyte memory and 32 core computers with dx12 graphics cards, because after another 5 years of full blown scientifical incompetence, fakte optimization, fake development, fanboy-centric cronycapitalistic clownery, it will require that hardware as the absolute minimum to be able to do an automatic bubble sort of 3d objects above 25 fps….

…and a Russian made rocket delivered by the chinese army accidentally hits tsmc, and the only factory capable to produce all the hardware needed, will burn away within 30 seconds.

woooops.

Dont worry, there will be new pc replacement from china. Approx core2duo + radeon 9600 speed, with 4 gbyte ram with Linux. Just the unity made ticktocktoe will run at 0.1 fps with it.

If someone follows the situation around the globe, this actually have a possibility above 50%. And i lost my patience for those who cant write two for cycles to render polygons, i agree that there will be big surprises sooner or later in our industry.

Programmer71 said:
I agree totally with your point of view, but, in the very next future, there will be no more experts on 3d

That's a plot used a lot in dystopian future novels, but rarely is a problem in real life.

In the dystopian future nobody knows how to maintain or build what was done in the past. People become so divorced from the underpinnings that the entire structure collapses.

About the only time I know if in history where something like it happened was the fall of the Roman empire. It's a fascinating thing to study, but the biggest takeaway was that it wasn't because of the people who were in the system, it took a dedicated action by invading forces to actively kill people who had the specialized knowledge, and to actively prevent people from spreading the knowledge. This happened with several successive invasions, each more devastating from the last, and features about waterway management and building waterproof lining in structures, through to general infrastructure management, all were lost over a couple generations and the massive society collapsed.

It is absolutely true that the knowledge has become specialized, and that's true across all society. I couldn't explain to you the nuance of the process of finding an oil field to creating gasoline, although I know vague details and I depend on my vehicle to get around. I couldn't explain to you the nuance of making synthetic fabrics like polyester or Spectra fibers, although I use them frequently. I couldn't explain to you the nuance of starting with a beach of silicon sand and building a modern 5nm CPU, although I have enough background experience to roughly explain how to isolate and purify the metals, a rough understanding of toking and manufacture of old-style integrated circuits, and I can wire up a 4-bit adder with transistors, resistors, and patience. Would you consider any of that a problem?

There are enough people who want to be experts on 3D. There are enough reference materials. There are active researchers, and people who want to dig deeper into it. There are people who want to be game engine developers rather than gameplay developers. There are people who want to do the mathematics around complex lighting scenarios, people who want to understand the tasks of instancing in hardware, and that's good enough for me.

Programmer71 said:
Recently I have read that Unity got into a partnership with … expect a lot of unwanted bloatware with newer unity versions.

The tricky thing about “bloat” and “waste” is that it is only considered bad if you don't use it. Look at government programs, when you review them objectively none are “bad”, there are just “those that I agree with" and “those that I don't agree with”. In game engines there are “features I use” and “features I don't use”. If it is a feature you use it is essential, useful, and a great service. If it is a feature you don't use, it is easy to (wrongly) accuse it of being bloat or problematic. It is more correct to see it instead as a feature that other people might use but you have no immediate need for.

Geri said:
If someone follows the situation around the globe, this actually have a possibility above 50%. And i lost my patience for those who cant write two for cycles to render polygons, i agree that there will be big surprises sooner or later in our industry.

Well, from some quick searches there are about 25 million programmers in the world today, and of those realistically less than 1% are into graphics, probably far less. Following from your logic, that means you must not be able to tolerate 99.975% of people. That sounds like a difficult life decision, but yours to make.

Trying to get back to the topic of publishers, you build your pitch, make the strongest business case that you can, and do your best. They might accept the pitch or might not. It says nothing about you as a person, nor about the tools and technology you used. You can continue pitching it to other people, look for ways to make the pitch more attractive, or move on to the next thing, none of those choices place any blame or guilt or shame or make statements about your identity or value as a person.

One piece of advice that I've been given, as I recall--and which may be in the links that I previously gave, I'm not sure--is to pitch widely, to many publishers, all at once. The more offers you have on the table, the better a position you are in to negotiate and to choose.

I've also been advised to pitch first to publishers from my intended list that I think to be worse fits for my game, so that I can tweak my pitch if called for when approaching those who I think to be better fits for my game.

frob said:

Following from your logic, that means you must not be able to tolerate 99.975% of people

Oh i thought we talking about people in gamedev, not from plumbers and taxi drivers.