There are some major questions you need to answer before you can really begin design.

Multiplayer - Non-Mulitplayer?
If you do multiplayer you need to deside if it's going to be a large world multiplayer or a small dungeon hack world like diablo.

Linear - Non-Linear?
I don't think you can combine these two types of rpg's because thier design is dramatically different. Linear games, usualy have a smaller much more detailed world. Most non-linear games have a large much less detailed world. Compair Daggerfall to Zelda 64. Big difference.

Strong Plot - Weak Multi-Plots?
The above choices would most likely deturmine this. Most largescale multiplayer games and non-linear games use multiple plots to keep interest. Where as linear games need a fine detailed plot.

*If your planning on doing a good plot, just as a suggestion, learn how to write story's first, it will help drastically. Usually it's more interesting in a thick plot to have many dynamic charecters.

We'll I hope that wasn't too long.

Gary

DatsIt: The "cheat utilities" I am referring to are specific software that are made by users of the game for the purpose of cheating. By this I mean running another program, often called a "trainer," during the game to make the character invincible, allow him to walk through walls, edit stats, create hacked items, crash other people's games (in multiplayer games), create false images, among other things. Creating a program like that takes a thorough knowledge of assembly (from what I hear) and a lot of work. This "magic" is done by finding and changing certain memory locations. "Trainers" work kind of like the Game Genie and Game Shark, except of course that they're for the PC.

I am NOT referring to press-the-right-buttons-and-find-a-secret-character game secrets. I believe that plenty of those secrets should exist. They revitalize games when they begin to get old and generate interest on game discussion boards. (I just recently located the special button combination to give X his ultimate armor in MegaMan X4. Played it the entire day. )

And I personally believe, that with a little extra effort, a programmer could make a game MUCH harder to hack.

Like you said: the cheat utilities are going to be created anyway. But if the game is much harder to hack into, won't there be fewer utilities? And besides that, it is not just 5 people creating their own utilities and then those same 5 people use them. It's more like a 5:5000 ratio (depending of course on the popularity of the game). So if you cut it down to 3 people making the utilities, you've cut the number of people cheating by 2000. Not bad for a few tricks, eh?

RPGs should never be so hard that you can't finish them! Most of those difficult areas are the ones where there was a mix-up between the manual/documentation creators and the game content creators. Others are simply bugs (i.e., programmer forgetting to factor a certain number into a spell equation -- then it does triple damage). They are all design errors. Design errors should be fixed by patches and updates. Not by unlicensed third-party utilities! When programmers shirk their responsibilities to the players of the game, someone else will pick up the slack but the game itself will suffer.

About the level of customization. Game content is created through many hours of hard work, on the part of all involved. I will cite Diablo as being an example of a large quantity of items. With a little work and some creativity they created a simple system that allowed for the dynamic creation of thousands of different items. They didn't have to create them all by hand. They simply used the laws of probability to multiply their efforts and add more variety to the game play. So it isn't that hard.

Finally, I would like to clarify what I was saying earlier about being able to customize the game. There will always be those people who like the game and those that don't. Hence, game discussion forums. However, I was talking about allowing the game to adjust to the player's particular playing style. Like hacking through hordes of enemies with an Axe? Fine! Just pick the warrior and be done with it! Or do you like dueling with spells? Take your pick! We've got spells for teleporting, increasing/decreasing abilities, physical damage spells, elemental spells.

You don't have to create twenty different characters; just allow the weapons and armor to be used to customize a few characters accordingly.

See where I'm going with this? Allow each player to fulfill his dreams within the game's story and he'll like it. That's what role-playing is all about.

- null_pointer

P.S. I apologize if I sounded a little unclear in my first post.

[This message has been edited by null_pointer (edited December 24, 1999).]

Is there a prize for the longest post?

H A P P Y H O L I D A Y S

- null_pointer

I really don't think that the developer should do anything to try and block someone from making a cheat or trainer for your game. I believe that these would increase the popularity and enjoyment factor of the game. The people that use these utilities are most often stuck somewhere in your game and a cheat might help them get over that one obsticle. As for FPS's the user might just want to run around and blow people apart with the biggest weapon your game offers.

The only part that I feel should be protected cheating in multi-player games. The people using the cheats are the only people having fun. And that is the bottom line of what makes your game successful. It has to be fun. If someone gets stuck, they need help getting past that point. If they can't, then they might get frustrated and give up. If that happens then they might recomend to other people to buy a different game.

Besides, If they bought the game, they should be able to do anything they want to it while it is on thier computer.

I agree. Let the player do whatever he wants in terms of cheating or trainer programs (or even do what Blizzard do and provide cheats) and let them at it. It's on their conscience. But only allow them as much leeway as possible without it affecting anyone else. In singleplayer, this is fine. In multiplayer, be careful.

Personally, I would stress working on a singleplayer game to begin with. With all the hoopla over multiplayer (I have and always will prefer the purity of single player), it just becomes another marketing buzzword. Better to master other aspects of game making first before plunging into the messy world of multiplayer gaming.

Blizzard provides cheats??

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- <b>null_pointer</b>

First off I HATE cheats... In RPGs that is. A RPG is a challage to the player and if the player cheats his/her way through the game what have you accomplished. Besides the lose of about $40 for the cool new game you got. Nothing. As for what makes a RPG great is... Creativity, new ideals. I hate seeing the same thing over and over in RPG's. Also, of course Freedom of the Character. Story line and plot in my oppion also is what makes a great RPG. Online or offline. Offline games like Lufia, I didn't think the controls, graphics, or music was very good for that game yet... the story line was awsome and keep me going. When it comes to Online games... UO for instance, Plots and story lines ARE NEEDED!!! When I first started UO I thought it was a truly great game, After a month I still liked it... Then it just got to repetitive, just running around aimlesly killing stuff, storing stuff, and selling stuff. That got old fast... needly to say I think UO is very boring now and a wast of time. If the game had enough random quest, plots, story lines, I think it would has kept my attention longer. Also, Players for the most part didn't know how to roleplay. But that's not the Games fault.

Well any way that's what I think, sorry about the writting errors, I not a english major.

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Jason M. Goebel
JMGoebel0@aol.com

Wow, wish I would have found this thread earlier. Lets see.

Cheats: Ah you can't stop them. 80/20 rule applies here and as developers you should develop with that in mind to prevent running overtime and overbudget. The vast majority of people don't use them maliciously anyway and in multiplayer games I tend to stay away from cheaters and don't play with them. Nuf said.

Someone posted that the RPG world is nebulous. This couldn't be more correct. When I compare sports games to RPGs I notice one thing. RPGs draw the game rules from life and sometimes fantasy life. Sports draw game rules from a small 100 page book you can get at a Barnes and Nobles. BIG difference here. What this means to the developer is essentially the same thing that a novelist faces or a director faces with each new book or movie. Given the HUGE array of possibilities I have, how do I get my point, story, or anecdote across to the viewer/reader.

In games all these rules of life come out as constraints withing the processing power of a computer. How deep do I make the world, or what about character involvement. How many skills should I have, and in what ways can those skills be used. What combat tactics can I use..... Since we have limited resources on the computer we have to quantify these rules of our virtual world and decide which ones we want to use to tell our story. Creating a game that balances all of the variables is essential.

This is why RPGs are so difficult to make. This is why movies are so hard to make and books so hard to write. Arguing here about which feature is better than another only leads to subjective opinions that are all correct and makes about as much sense as arguing that Michael Jordan should be #2 to Babe Ruth in ESPNs Greatest Athlete series. The answer for your development team should be which answers given here feel right to the team. Following through by marketing to that segment that your team identifies with will help create a successful game.

Enough with the philosophical bulls*^t. What I look for in an RPG is a sense that I am part of something bigger. Resident Evil while not an RPG perse had this feeling. The books found in the game told of a story that could and did directly affect me. That game did the emotional thing we talk about. I still remember the first time I saw the rabid dogs crash through the windows. *shiver* Anyway give me an immersive world, with lots of choices and a non-intrusive interface to go about my business. Lace the whole thing with a snazzy plot, lots of eye candy and the ability to share my experiences with others and I am all over the game. Oh it has to be bug free and install in seconds. Lastly don't forget the incredible sound track and sound effects. Without them the world is not as believable.

I'd say that the key to an RPG's success revolves around building up an attachment to your character. This requires a strong story (and one that doesn't inspire the "so what?" response in players), NPCs who are at least believable enough to make you feel that your character is important, and some form of character development (to encourage the power gamer types!). It has to be said that I STILL think of Ultima 6 as the best RPG ever.... it had a very strong story, quite believable (if repetitive - but thats okay) NPCs and an okay graphics engine. In general, I couldn't care less what an RPG *looks* like - if anything, too much emphasis on graphics scares away players with lower-end machines.... and takes the emphasis away from my imagination. The scariest monster is the one you don't see, after all. Graphics, sound, etc. really are secondary to a solid plot, good characters, etc.

A personal peeve of mine against a lot of modern RPGs is that there is WAY too much combat, and insufficient ways around fight scenes. I like to develop a character who is more than a Diablo-esque firebolt slinging machine. NPC AI generally sucks, and I can confidently say that I'll win any combats that are put into a game (assuming that they are set up to be winnable) (I used to be European League of Gamer's wargaming champion, and I tend to win at Quake/Unreal type deathmatch games - hence, combat is rarely a problem from either tactical or "twitch gaming" angles). Thats no fun. What *is* fun is trying to think of an innovative way around the problem. Warren Spector (currently working on Deus Ex, and of Ultima Underworld fame) has repeatedly pointed to this in his recent writings.

Oh, and it helps if the user interface is simple enough that I won't scream at it - but that is a secondary consideration. I like Ultima IX, even though its interface sucks, to get a decent frame rate I have to put graphics on hideously low detail, and it still crashes every 2 hours!

My Development team and I are in progress of developing an RPG that will be a 3D User interface.
My question is, What is your opinion on what makes an RPG a hit, whether it be music, graphics, and plot, (What kind of plot, please give me the most elaborate response you can.!)
So far, we figure it will be in a classic D&D sort of style, but with many twists that these earliet RPG's did not offer. We want to pleasantly surprise people.
our plan is a semi-oldworld RPG theme...
Classical/New age/techno Soundtrack.
DirectX enhanced 3D engine, maps designed buy our 3D editor program, and lots of combat/action intregrated in a fairly complex world, many puzzles to conquest.
We estimate 60hrs+ Gameplay.

Any input is appreciated!

Steve - Music Composer, Game Design Assistant,

thanks...

[This message has been edited by stviemr (edited December 16, 1999).]