Quote: Original post by Talroth
I'm going to have to disagree with how you phrased that. I think a far better view is "the application of creative energy to something destined solely to be destroyed is a bad thing."

You can frame it either way, depending on how much you want to castigate the developers versus how much you want to castigate Activision. The two views are not mutually exclusive.

Quote: Original post by Antheus
You're absolutely right. They are terrorists. Why do they hate freedom so much? Why do they want fundamentalists to win?

No, really - stealing?

Infringement perhaps. And ideas cannot be protected under any law, so they cannot be stolen. The only time an idea can be stolen is in a phrase, but it has no legal meaning.

Or more accurately, neither. Up until now, they had a licensing agreement which permitted them development. Now this license was revoked.

Suddenly, they don't sound like such morons anymore.

No stealing was going on, no infringement, just an authorized fan project, who got ground to bits as collateral damage of large corporate politics. It's highly likely that nobody in either of the companies knows about it. When mergers and such restructurings occur, they follow certain set of processes. It's most likely that while reviewing existing IP, lawyers didn't find a proper form for "fan project", so they simply defaulted to C&D, without even knowing what it was about.

Yawn...so maybe stealing was the wrong word to use.

You're probably right it was just a lawyer seeing something wrong and shutting it down then Activision just crushing it on a whim. But the story is trying to be spun as the poor underdogs got ground under the oppressive corporate heel and all the bleeding heart liberals got new ammo to hate big publishers with again. The fact is if they hadn't tried to ride the coat tails of the King's Quest name and instead created an original IP none of this would have happend. Its not like King's Quest is in some inspired unqiue world. The only reason to use the name was to get the old adventure gamers interested in it. So yeah, they are still morons.

Quote: Original post by btower

Quote: Original post by Binomine
Even if what Activision did was legal

Are you questioning the legality of this?

No I am not.

I know Activision had the legal right,they exercised their legal rights and that laws are not morals.

Even if what they did was legal, they're still jerks for yanking the contract and you should fell at least a little bad for the people working in good faith with an agreement that was made with the previous IP owner. They had no control over who the IP was sold to.

Is it really any different than someone who worked hard for a small game company for 8 years only to have their company sold to a larger company and their project cancelled? I know a lot of people expressed sympathy for all the game companies that closed their doors in the last two years, but is this really any different than that? Do you feel any sympathy for someone who lost their job, even if they worked hard for 8 years, due to events outside their control?

I personally would feel a bit of sympathy for all 3, but I guess someone who worked hard for 8 years only to have the door shut in their face is "stupid".

Yes, their contract sucked, but someone who is hired for a job in any "at will" state has just as horrible a contract as this game.

Quote: I don't have sympathy for the fact that those 8 years are wasted because they chose to violate IP rights of somebody else. They should have gotten concent before they started working on the project.

No fault of their own? That's just not correct.

They did in fact have a "concert" that was pulled.

Let me ask you this, should a person not follow their dreams because they're not in a position to negotiate a good contract, even if they got the best contract that has ever existed for a fan game?

Quote: Original post by Talroth
Creating a new world, especially fantasy, is Not really that hard. Yes, it takes time and effort to develop a detailed and interesting world, but a very basic world in which to frame a story?

Way to miss the whole point.

Does being a derivative work, legal or otherwise, have ANY bearing on the quality of the work. Is Tobal No. 1 a better fighting game than Super Smash Brothers because TN.1 decided to develop their own IP, which SSB used existing IP? It doesn't matter if it's easy to create characters for a fighting game, that's non-sequitur to the question.

Quote: Original post by jtagge75
Hopefully they can retool the game away from KQ and still get something put out.

They can't. They included locations and background stories that are deeply woven into the plot. A rewrite would require a reboot of the entire project.

Quote: Original post by Binomine

Quote: Original post by jtagge75
Hopefully they can retool the game away from KQ and still get something put out.

They can't. They included locations and background stories that are deeply woven into the plot. A rewrite would require a reboot of the entire project.

Then they reboot the project with a new script, and modify existing art. Unless every art asset has "Daventry" (or whatever the kingdom is) scribbled across it, then it shouldn't be useless.

Quote:
Is it really any different than someone who worked hard for a small game company for 8 years only to have their company sold to a larger company and their project cancelled? I know a lot of people expressed sympathy for all the game companies that closed their doors in the last two years, but is this really any different than that? Do you feel any sympathy for someone who lost their job, even if they worked hard for 8 years, due to events outside their control?

Its quite different. Yes, its sad that events outside of their control stopped the project, but this was a voluntary thing and in no way comparable to someone losing their job.

On the other hand, these people could have taken inspiration from Kings Quest and *still* made their own IP. Most games (even commercial ones) borrow heavily from ones that came before.

Quote:
Let me ask you this, should a person not follow their dreams because they're not in a position to negotiate a good contract, even if they got the best contract that has ever existed for a fan game?

They are free to follow their dreams, but they cannot count on their dreams being concrete. The corporate world is a fickle place. They followed their dreams as far as they could, now they have to accept reality too.

Quote: Original post by rip-off

Quote:
Is it really any different than someone who worked hard for a small game company for 8 years only to have their company sold to a larger company and their project cancelled? I know a lot of people expressed sympathy for all the game companies that closed their doors in the last two years, but is this really any different than that? Do you feel any sympathy for someone who lost their job, even if they worked hard for 8 years, due to events outside their control?

Its quite different. Yes, its sad that events outside of their control stopped the project, but this was a voluntary thing and in no way comparable to someone losing their job.

A job is entirely a voluntary thing, unless you're a slave.

Quote: n the other hand, these people could have taken inspiration from Kings Quest and *still* made their own IP. Most games (even commercial ones) borrow heavily from ones that came before.

Let's forget King's Quest for a second and talk about Wicked. Gregory Maguire could have made an Oz-like world, but he had a point to make using the characters of OZ.

It is a valid artistic expression and one that shouldn't be looked down upon simply because he didn't develop his own IP. (It should looked down upon that he's a crappy writer, but point aside)

Quote:

Quote:
Let me ask you this, should a person not follow their dreams because they're not in a position to negotiate a good contract, even if they got the best contract that has ever existed for a fan game?

They are free to follow their dreams, but they cannot count on their dreams being concrete. The corporate world is a fickle place. They followed their dreams as far as they could, now they have to accept reality too.

I agree, my main complaint was that people insulting the team for trying.

Quote:
A job is entirely a voluntary thing, unless you're a slave.

Have fun in your fantasy dream land.

Quote: Original post by rip-off

Quote:
A job is entirely a voluntary thing, unless you're a slave.

Have fun in your fantasy dream land.

I really must applaud this poster. I don't think I've seen a retort this witty and well-constructed since first grade. Honestly, most relevant and topical response to the issue at hand I've seen in all my years.

Quote: Original post by rian carnarvon

Quote: Original post by rip-off

Quote: A job is entirely a voluntary thing, unless you're a slave.

Have fun in your fantasy dream land.

Cool story bro

^^Fixed =D

Quote: Original post by rian carnarvon

Quote: Original post by rip-off

Quote:
A job is entirely a voluntary thing, unless you're a slave.

Have fun in your fantasy dream land.

I really must applaud this poster. I don't think I've seen a retort this witty and well-constructed since first grade. Honestly, most relevant and topical response to the issue at hand I've seen in all my years.

/me bows