For people who spend a lot of time producing music on the PC, do you take any special precautions when listening to music? Do use headgear? What type do you use or avoid? Because I've started making some music on the PC for the first time, and my ears hurt. I get the kind of feeling like I just got out of the pool. I listen to music regularly on my PC (using earbuds), and I have never experienced this kind of pain before.

Firstly, you're listening too loud and probably too long without a break.

Ear Buds are a poor choice of listening device for working. Are you controlling your peaks? Produced music is compressed and limited so the music is more 'even', when you're composing if you're not limiting, the peaks can be over the threshold you should be listening at. Specially drums and such.

You may want to invest in a good pair of monitors headphones (if speakers aren't an option - something open backed like Sennheiser HD595s.

If you have monitors (speakers) you don't want to monitor at over 90db SPL. You can measure this with an SPL Meter. You can pick one up from radio shack or somewhere online. Wherever you are sitting and listening from with speakers, is where you should be measuring the sound pressure level - SPL from both speakers together).

Also 85-90dB is what you typically mix at not compose at. Composition doesn't have to be at that loudness.

At 85-90dB you will experience ear fatigue after about 8hrs. You should take a 5 minute break every 30 minutes anyway. It's like smelling, you go in a room with a doggy smell, and after a while it becomes less, your senses desensitize. Leaving for a while gives your senses a break and when you come back in the doggy smell is there again :).

Quote: Original post by samster581
my ears hurt. I get the kind of feeling like I just got out of the pool.
I listen to music regularly on my PC (using earbuds), and I have never experienced this kind of pain before.

Lose the earbuds now! You should not experience pain, ringing, or loss of hearing from working. Listen to what your body is telling you. If you have pain STOP what you are doing.

The "swimming pool" feeling probably comes from having the earbuds in for too long.

As yjbrown said, you're probably monitoring at too loud a level. That combined with the earbuds directing all the sound right at your eardrum can cause permanent damage if you continue working this way.

As he has already said, even 85-90 dB is too loud for most composition situations. Go with either some decent quality speakers or some good quality headphones. Better quality monitors will allow you to listen at a lower level and still have clarity.

Take those breaks. You only get one set of ears, and they can't be repaired or returned if broken. Treat them gently. They are fragile.

More often than not, when I use pencil and paper, I compose at around 0db. :P Even when on the computer, I always make sure that my volumes are never louder than necessary.

If you have trouble hearing a certain part being played back, instead of jacking the volume, perhaps just fix the dynamic for that instrument, or perhaps alter your orchestration so that the texture is less thick.

^^That was just an example of something to keep in mind. :)

When mowing the lawn, or operating anything that's loud, I always wear ear protection to lessen the damage on my ears.

Muzo and yjbrown have excellent advice - listen to your body. You have pain for a reason.

If you work on a computer primarily, make sure that you also take a 30-second to a 1-minute break every 10 or so minutes from looking at the computer monitor. By looking at different objects at different distances, you are using different eye muscles that are important for maintaining your vision.

Be nice to your ears! :)

Without a SPL Meter, I suppose there's no good way to measure the sound levels coming out of my PC?
It would be nice to have some headphones that limit sound to some specific dB level, rather than some nameless 1 to 10 knob.

Quote: Original post by samster581
Without a SPL Meter, I suppose there's no good way to measure the sound levels coming out of my PC?

No, but dude, it's only like $50, and you only need to buy it once, and it'll also let you calibrate your speakers' frequency response so that you can accurately hear what sounds you're making.

Wow, this is a very bad sign! Like the others have mentioned, you do NOT want to experience pain at any time while working with audio. I've been doing this since 2000 and a large majority of the time I never experience ear pain. If I start to, I adjust the volume output or take a break.

I agree with most points. Drop the buds. You want an around the ear type of headphone, if you must use headphones. I'm not sure what your budget is but you can pick up a good pair for about $100.

Depending on what software you're using, a large majority have dB meters and monitoring plug-ins bundled in. Some don't. Get something set up where you can see what level you're working at. Also make it a practice to pre-mix and make music at a lower dB range as these sessions are often longer. Occasionally try testing other levels (louder, much louder, softer, much softer) to see how your music comes off at various listening levels.

Take some breaks. Like yjbrown said, you need to take some breaks because your ears (and mind) gets tired the longer you work. You'll get to a point where you're not listening as closely or accurately if you're getting tired. Take a break and go do something that doesn't involve loud audio or thinking about music-audio-production-etc. This will usually refresh your mind, spirit and ears when you come back to it.

Quote: Original post by samster581
It would be nice to have some headphones that limit sound to some specific dB level, rather than some nameless 1 to 10 knob.

If you're really concerned then I'd suggest placing a light limiter on your master track. Something that wont be abrasive enough to alter your overall sound too much but will keep the balance level in check. That or just keep your volume knob in the same place at all times... once you find a level that is safer to work with.

What type(s) of music are you creating? What programs are you using? Care to share some with us?

I hope that helps,

Nate

I've done a bit of work with safe sound levels for work (OS&H) as I work in the live entertainment field. Audio exposure in the workplace is both considered as a peak level and an average over the 8 hour working day. The recommended average over 8 hours is actually very low (about 80-85db from memory). As levels get higher the exposure time gets dramatically shorter. I also highly recommend some studio monitors or at the least some good headphones, you can't get an accurate feel of the sound with buds.

Try not to listen for any length of time much louder than a normal conversation.

I have met a lot of sound guys and musicians with pretty bad hearing problems from the old days of it's never loud enough.

Just as an aside I read some papers suggesting that compressed audio like mp3 can actually be more damaging to hearing as the sound can peak higher than perceived in certain frequencies due to the compression process.

Quote: Original post by kal_jez
Just as an aside I read some papers suggesting that compressed audio like mp3 can actually be more damaging to hearing as the sound can peak higher than perceived in certain frequencies due to the compression process.

I don't know about scientific data on damage, but highly compressed music can definitely be more fatiguing. Much of my work involves doing detailed transcriptions of music tracks. Whenever a highly compressed pop song or a low quality MP3 is sent over, I know I'm in for a rough day. I can't work nearly as long without a break on compressed audio. The ears just tire out faster.

Don't use compression as a way to fight ear damage. It won't work. Also, software peak meters in your computer will tell you nothing about the levels of sound coming out of your speakers unless you are working in a calibrated environment. If you are using earbuds, then you are not working in such an environment.

If you don't buy an SPL meter and calibrate your listening environment, then at the very least, turn down the volume and take frequent breaks.

Ear damage is real and permanent.

Quote: Original post by Muzo72
Don't use compression as a way to fight ear damage.

Mastered audio (that has used compression and limited) is 'controlled', when you listen at a certain volume it's not going to spike louder than that volume.

My original comment about listening music vs writing music is that if for whatever reason you happen to be monitoring at a loud level in your ear buds and you get a spike you have a real chance of damaging your hearing.

The safest bet is monitors, and compose at a lower volume. When it comes time to mix and master that is when you need to monitor at 85-90db, with breaks.

Quote: Original post by Muzo72
but highly compressed music can definitely be more fatiguing

By it's very nature, it's kept at a constant high level. It's like standing next to heavy machinery or a loud engine. Your ears will tire quickly.

I live in the USA now, and the amount of people driving their cars with huge stereos in their cars, listening at full volume so much so that their number plates rattle is shockingly higher than anywhere else I've ever lived in the world.

These guys think they're so 'cool'. But they're totally uneducated and ignorant of the fact that they are damaging their hearing. 'COOL' now, clinically DEAF later.