What do you think of ego weapons?

Ketchaval,

Do you even want an endless line of weapons? Just a thought, but the whole problem with +8, +19, +99000 whatever, is that it''s trying to fake change and growth in a static... argh, paradigm (for total lack of a better word).

Here''s what I mean: Either you do the same thing, you deepen or heighten that thing, vary it, or do something else. In a hack & slash you only get to do one thing, like you pointed out it''s the economic leveling up system. I don''t have a problem w/ this per se, but for me it gets boring after awhile and I''m unimpressed by +99,000 Sword of Slaying.

I''d be in favor of varying how stuff works. For that, you need a lot of variables in a system that can be affected (I think, anyway). I know folks have talked about this before, but what about being able to take actions such as: poisoning, blinding, misdirecting, trapping, etc., etc. IOW, weapons and actions have more varied effects and personality.

Is this anything like what your talking about, or am I missing the point?

--------------------
Just waiting for the mothership...

I would advocate a more varied combat system. By only having one or two numbers to tweak (to hit and damage) you eventually get stuck with +7 Wand of Instant Death. This system is ok if combat is incidental to your game design, but in today''s games (RPG/ Stat) combat is a core element.

So what you have is simply insufficient.

Other ways to tweak things:
Area of Effect
Attack Speed
Range or Reach
Type of damage (crushing vs sharp)
Secondary effects (setting folks on fire)
Cost or Production Time

The fundamental problem never goes away, but you have more vriables to play with and so can put off the +7 Wand of Death for longer. Maybe even past the conclusion of the game, so the player never gets there. In order to eliminate the fundamental problem you need to remove the reward of *better* equipment.

Good points folks I''d like to see more interesting weapons in games , I think the answer to the +7 / + 8 question is : nothing they both cause instant death .

Wavinator, I''d definitely prefer to see more alternative weapon effects ie. the fire stuff.

Morfe, Cool idea !! Making weapons which look Magical, this is a GREAT implementation of Creativity in Play (you might want to look at that thread for some interesting stuff). Of course how you would limit the amount of these in play ?

Paul, what is an ego weapon ? (I''m not a big manga reader, although I reckon that it is a good source of inspiration for game designers in terms of new settings, ie. duelling by eating faster than the opponent .)


(Of course this doesn''t just extend to Weapons, it includes any available commodity in a game, whether it is arable land or a new dishwasher, or a better trained athlete, or a more reliable troop transport Helicoptor, a trophy for killing goblins, or a bear-skin hat... etc.)

An ego weapon. Hmm... A weapon who''s power is based on the character''s own sense of self-worth and self-importance. That''s certainly interesting. You''d need to actually add a stat for that though (it''d be good if a character''s ego would inflate with every damsel/ in distress he/she saved).

A thought I had (more an alteration of the DBZ, flared emotion=flared strength thing) was mood-based weapons. For example, a Rage Sword. It only becomes powerful when facing your mortal enemy or a party member dies or something and you become enraged. Again, there would need to some indication of this (be it a stat, character''s appearance, battle text). Of course, other examples could include the Happy Dagger, the Staff of Melancholy, the Axe of Boredom and the Pike of Indifference. Of course those sound silly but you get the point.

Though why apply these things only to weapons, spells/skills could do it too. For example: ice spells working especially well for the cold-hearted type, fire for anger, etc.

My last thought to avoid the +7 Wand of Instant Death problem is to make weapons like that degrade over time. The +7 Wand of Instant Death eventually becomes the +2 Wand of Mild Nausea or something like that. That way things can be balanced and depending on the degradation, very funny (if the battle effect changed from instant death to the enemy finding a corner to vomit in, in this specific example).

Well, that''s enough out of me.

-Goku, inanely rambling off into the sunset.

OK.

Correct me if I''m wrong, but by ego weapons, you mean weapons w/ a self-or semi-self-awareness i.e. their own willpower/personality?

Very cool. Reminds me of Vampire Hunter D. Usually would be "bad" game design (taking control out of player''s hands) but this is definately one of those rule-benders that works. If you want that n^n Vorpal Sword of Breath-Freshening, you have to put up w/ say, a whiny weapon that won''t take on the dragon until its had it''s noontime nap. Or the ressurected spirit of a berzerker takes lives in the sword and demands BLOOD, even if you''re in the middle of a crowded tavern. . .heh. . .the loss of control would certainly be worth it, as would the scads of hate mail you''d receive from disgruntled players. . .


If you see the Buddha on the road, Kill Him. -apocryphal

Anonymous: I disagree. Taking control out of the players hands is thouroughly annoying, and will invariably result in players taking one of the following two choices:

1. Walking about with the weapon anyway and reloading the game everytime it forces them to do something stupid

2. Decide that the weapon isnt worth the hassle and leave it behind. The weapon then becomes a waste of disk space

In either case, the game does not become more fun.

Maybe you should create a weapon system in which more powerful weapons actually hurt your magic growth. For instance, in Final Fantasy 7, the main characters ultimate weapon, (the Ultima Weapon) is insanely powerful, but any magic ("materia") equipped on it will not receive any experience after battle.

An Ego Weapon as i understand it is a weapon that has had a spirit/will forged into it. So when the weapon is held by someone the spirit can affect different things about it''s wielder. (It in Ad&d aswell) If the weilder has a differnt alignment to the being in the weapon then it he/she can''t use the weapon. In some cases the weapon can harm a person it doesn''t like who tries to use it. There can be many variations as you can see, it all comes down to the will/spirit in the weapon.

I guess you could also have ego items as well but usually these thing would be rare and the ego item/weapon would have a pretty vast history as well.

"So you're the one that designed that game are you?"
*Gulp* "Umm, yeah"

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> Ehm, why are all the villagers running away from me?
> D''OH!


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