I''m in the middle of working out how complicated a combat system could be for an rpg when its running real-time. In a turn-based environment you can make it quite complicated because the player isn''t being rushed to make decisions. It think this is why click and kill is a big feature in real-time combat systems for rpg''s. Another way i was think of having it is so the enemies don''t attack you straight away. This would give the player a bit more time to make decisions allowing me to add a bit more variety/complexity to the combat system. Does click and kill = realtime combat. My mind is still reasonably fresh on this so i''m very open to your thought''s. Any suggestions on different ways to do a realtime combat system for an rpg other than click and kill? I thought that it could be done vice versa so the enemies attack you and when this happens you''re actions could be slightly automated. Remember than when something is automated, this will then allow the player to be doing something else which in turn could allow me to make the combat system more complex. Any suggestions? I love Game Design and it loves me back. Our Goal is "Fun"!

Well, if you''re going to be using magick and/or ranged weapons, just allow the user to cast/fire in a direction and if it hits an enemy then a hit is recorded. For melee just swing your weapon in the direction your click is recorded. Allow weapons to be used without DIRECT targeting.

Make sense?

Yeah, it does make sence thanks.

I guess there is various ways of accomplishing this. One is gauntlet style which i presume is what you''re thinking of/yes? This would work well with projectile explosives as well although it tends to lean the game heavily into the arcade realm, doesn''t it?

You''ve given me another thought actually. The cursor could be represnted by a circle. When you click on the game screen you will shoot somewhere within the circle. As your accuracy increases the circle shrinks. This way a homing weapon would actually hold purpose because with them you could use the click and kill method. This will make it pretty easy to have ai levels as well i presume.

I love Game Design and it loves me back.

Our Goal is "Fun"!

I was going to post about this, but since ya beat me to it, I''ll do it here:

Representing accuracy: I like the shrinking circle idea. You might also do something like fading the cursor out (sort of like greyed out dialog options) the more inaccurate you are, or just make projectiles miss graphically. For melee weapons, it would be nice to actually *see* melee weapons miss as well.

Damage model might be another way to deal with accuracy: Maybe you do varying amounts of damage based on your accuracy? I''d favor multiples, so that really good accuracy is 2x or 4x or whatever times the base weapon.

As far as complication level... without it getting too cumbersome, I''d like to see the kind of AI options I get in Total Annihilation or Dark Reign. That is, I can set AI modes (close, keep maximum distance, charge, take cover). I don''t want to sit and have to script-- although, come to think of it, being able to add scripts offline and tie them to a button in the UI might be sweet.

Speaking of taking cover: for the RPG empire design I''m fooling with, you need to be able to command more than a small party at times. Just like in the best movies, this may be what cover is FOR! You duck for cover, set some waypoints, then hit a button to "execute plan B!" The things that''s cool about this is that it makes tactical combat more detailed because it involves timing and such.

What do you think?


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Just waiting for the mothership...

It sounds good and also very technical. I am personally tring to keep this straight forward plus i''m not to sure how tricky the scripting for our game will be yet. From what i read Wavinator, your talking alot about customization/correct?

I love Game Design and it loves me back.

Our Goal is "Fun"!

Paul,

Yeah, in terms of friendly AI behavior, I''m suggesting at the bare minimum some of the options that are standard for units in an RTS.

Take a simple game like Escape Velocity. You can hire pilots and have them travel with you. The orders are pretty simple: Hold Position; Attack My Target; and Attack Freely.

Otherwise, you end up with friendly AI that is: "Follow player x,y" and "Attack nearest target." Not saying there''s anything wrong with this-- it seems to work for the skeletons you raise as a Necromancer in Diablo 2-- I''d just like to see a bit more.

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Just waiting for the mothership...

I guess it would be also possible to somehow distiguish each type of npc/enemy from each other and somehow make it so that each on them hold very different values for the player. This could also change as the game continues in play. This way you could have clever scripting that recognises the values of an enemy/npc in relation to the players character.

I love Game Design and it loves me back.

Our Goal is "Fun"!

yeah, tactics setting that automatically adapt when the enemy encoutenred is known. "Oh yeah, that''s a goblin, if I hit too high, I''ll just miss them, so let''s aim low".

souds good to me.

Wavinator : If you need beta testers for your game, or feedback, I offer my services, I like your ideas more and more They remind me a lot of some of the stuff I wanna do, someday ...

ahw Quote -"
yeah, tactics setting that automatically adapt when the enemy
encoutenred is known. "Oh yeah, that''s a goblin, if I hit too high, I''ll just
miss them, so let''s aim low".

If you mean that the NPCs learn the best way to deal with the enemy, whilst that is a useful and interface simplifying concept. And better than them mucking up all the time. (Maybe they could even improve THEIR accuracy / tactics when YOU are low on Health, to help you out -Maybe this would be cool on easy difficulty modes, although I suspect that hardcore players would prefer to play with Themselves saving the day).


What would be more interesting than the NPC (party members) learning good tactics (from you?) would be if the enemy were to learn how to deal with your attacks / minimising their damage, or by copying your attack methods. Ie. If you start killing the goblin tribe with fire bombs, they make flameproof armour or vehicles, they also may try and manufacture their own fire bombs. Which may be even more deadly than your own. (Which would be another way of dealing with the enemy - better weapon - tougher enemy Diablo style levelling "problem", and keep encounters with creatures that you have already met interesting.

actually, I am thinking *everybody*. That means the player too. I don''t think it would be too difficult to assign some shorcuts to tactical settings, to have a bit more variety and interesting things in combat. I mean, just the oversimplified Coward/Normal/Berserk setting is a good start...