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Operating Systems
Author
Last night, I watched a student play Starcraft on an open source operating system. The OS is amazing, it''s got a totally cool look, and it''s easy to use. He was also running a PowerBook G3, not a PC. . .
That''s right, Mac OS X has gone to open source, basing many of the components on FreeBSD. Code-named "Darwin," it promises to bring a whole new playing field to computing. Apparently, it''s designed for both developers and users, unlike Microsoft, which is for users, or Linux, which is basically still stuck being mostly for developers (which is changing, but it may be too late; people are sticking with their stereotypes of this OS).
The advantage of Mac OS X is simple: Everybody using a Macintosh computer is already using some version of Mac OS, so it''ll just be another upgrade for their operating system, they won''t really notice (or care) that its development involved people outside Apple; they''ll just know that it''s much better than anything they''ve seen before. Also, Mac OS X will probably bring in a lot of converts, if they play their cards right.
So, what do you think?
Please, keep flames to a minimum. If you don''t believe me, go to their web page, and click on "Mac OS X" and scroll to the bottom of the page, then click on the "OPEN" sign. Then go exploring.
-CobraA1
"If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away" --Henry David Thoreau
Uhh, no.
MacOS X is NOT open source, or Free software, or anything like that. Now, i like MacOS X, at least compared to most comercial OS''s, but it simply is not open sourced.
The kernel, however, is an open FreeBSD derivative kernel. It''s called Darwin, and it brings with it a lot of the benefits of Free systems along with the power of *nix. However, the kernel alone is not an operating system, and everything on top of that is very much closed.
Frankly, i trust Apple about as much as i trust Microsoft, with their business practices in the past. It''ll be a while before you see me running Apple software, but i do think it''s great that more OS''s are moving towards the POSIX standard. As more things are standardized on UNIX-like cores, it will be easier and easier to port programs from one to the other and to develop for almost any configuration imaginable. UNIX has not stuck around for so long out of sheer marketing strength (unlike some other OS''s) all these years; it has very strong roots. It''s great to see people move towards it.
A few other points: while, yes, it is the next of the progression of Macintosh operating systems, it is not an upgrade to MacOS9. It is very much different, and judging from what they have now, it will even be fairly different on the UI level. We''ll see if that changes as we approach the release date.
As for MacOSX being for both end users and developers, yes, it does seem that that''s where they''ve been heading from the start with Rhapsody. I wouldn''t count Linux out quite yet. It''s really getting a foothold on the imbedded market, and not only does that mean that people will be using Linux unbeknownst to them, but it also means that a lot of the nice UI and infrastructure will be leaking into the PC market. It''ll be interesting times.
With MacOSX as with all even remotely Free *nix''s, i still feel the same way. We shouldn''t compete against each other (not for destruction at least, some friendly competition never hurt), but should work together to bring Free software to a higher level, a level above proprietary software.
And it is for that reason that i won''t be using MacOSX. Free Software all the way!
-Benc
MacOS X is NOT open source, or Free software, or anything like that. Now, i like MacOS X, at least compared to most comercial OS''s, but it simply is not open sourced.
The kernel, however, is an open FreeBSD derivative kernel. It''s called Darwin, and it brings with it a lot of the benefits of Free systems along with the power of *nix. However, the kernel alone is not an operating system, and everything on top of that is very much closed.
Frankly, i trust Apple about as much as i trust Microsoft, with their business practices in the past. It''ll be a while before you see me running Apple software, but i do think it''s great that more OS''s are moving towards the POSIX standard. As more things are standardized on UNIX-like cores, it will be easier and easier to port programs from one to the other and to develop for almost any configuration imaginable. UNIX has not stuck around for so long out of sheer marketing strength (unlike some other OS''s) all these years; it has very strong roots. It''s great to see people move towards it.
A few other points: while, yes, it is the next of the progression of Macintosh operating systems, it is not an upgrade to MacOS9. It is very much different, and judging from what they have now, it will even be fairly different on the UI level. We''ll see if that changes as we approach the release date.
As for MacOSX being for both end users and developers, yes, it does seem that that''s where they''ve been heading from the start with Rhapsody. I wouldn''t count Linux out quite yet. It''s really getting a foothold on the imbedded market, and not only does that mean that people will be using Linux unbeknownst to them, but it also means that a lot of the nice UI and infrastructure will be leaking into the PC market. It''ll be interesting times.
With MacOSX as with all even remotely Free *nix''s, i still feel the same way. We shouldn''t compete against each other (not for destruction at least, some friendly competition never hurt), but should work together to bring Free software to a higher level, a level above proprietary software.
And it is for that reason that i won''t be using MacOSX. Free Software all the way!
-Benc
Author
Well, something''s going open source over there. Take a look at: http://www.publicsource.apple.com/
If Darwin is the core of Mac OS X, and Darwin is open source, then you could say that at least part of Mac OS X is open source.
I totally agree with you about Linux coming to the embedded market. They can fit Linux on a floppy disk, that''s scalability if I ever saw it.
Free software all the way? Can businesses really afford to put everything in source, only to have programmers give it away, instead of the business making money off of it?
You may be right about Mac OS X not being a simple upgrade. I just wanted to get peoples'' attention, I guess.
Gotta go to classes. Talk more later.
"If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away" --Henry David Thoreau
If Darwin is the core of Mac OS X, and Darwin is open source, then you could say that at least part of Mac OS X is open source.
I totally agree with you about Linux coming to the embedded market. They can fit Linux on a floppy disk, that''s scalability if I ever saw it.
Free software all the way? Can businesses really afford to put everything in source, only to have programmers give it away, instead of the business making money off of it?
You may be right about Mac OS X not being a simple upgrade. I just wanted to get peoples'' attention, I guess.
Gotta go to classes. Talk more later.
"If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away" --Henry David Thoreau
MacOS X is NOT Open Source. They made a UNIX style PPC/x86 OS (Darwin) from the Kernel, which is a BSD variant. MacOS X is a big change. It''s like NT 4.0 compared to Win32: New kernel, new memory management, new multithreading, new shell, new network subsystems...
Tim
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glvelocity.gamedev.net
www.gamedev.net/hosted/glvelocity
Tim
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glvelocity.gamedev.net
www.gamedev.net/hosted/glvelocity
Author
quote: Original post by tcs
MacOS X is NOT Open Source. They made a UNIX style PPC/x86 OS (Darwin) from the Kernel, which is a BSD variant. MacOS X is a big change. It''s like NT 4.0 compared to Win32: New kernel, new memory management, new multithreading, new shell, new network subsystems...
What is this about then? What''s the first project listed?
http://www.publicsource.apple.com/projects/
"If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away" --Henry David Thoreau
MacOS X != kernel
There is more to it than just a small, open source kernel. On the ''projects'' page, it says "Darwin is the core of Mac OS X". There''s a difference between "core" and "entire operating system".
Martee
Magnum Games
There is more to it than just a small, open source kernel. On the ''projects'' page, it says "Darwin is the core of Mac OS X". There''s a difference between "core" and "entire operating system".
Martee
Magnum Games
CobraA1 said:
> Free software all the way? Can businesses really afford to put everything in source, only to have programmers give it away, instead of the business making money off of it?
Frankly, i don''t really care about business. Although i do think it''s possible to base a business around Free software, that''s not the point. The point is that as long as we use OS''s that are controlled directly by companies, we''ll be using systems that are designed to keep the company in business, rather than systems designed for the user.
Although Apple does this, Microsoft is the bigger example of this, it''s why they''re in court now. Using the power that ownership of the OS grants to force their wills in other areas of software and hardware, expanding off the desktop and even into things like television, toys, and soon, appliances.
I say we stop it right here. I''m fine if a company wants to better a Free OS, or write one of it''s own, but as soon as that company has full control of the system in the way Apple does, i want no part of it, when there are Free alternatives. Free Software is not only a moral issue, but it is also pragmatic. When the system is developed Freely (that''s capital-F), then people will only stick with the developers as long as they''re developing what the users want.
As i said, i don''t care if it''s comercially viable; i want a Free system, and i got one.
benc
> Free software all the way? Can businesses really afford to put everything in source, only to have programmers give it away, instead of the business making money off of it?
Frankly, i don''t really care about business. Although i do think it''s possible to base a business around Free software, that''s not the point. The point is that as long as we use OS''s that are controlled directly by companies, we''ll be using systems that are designed to keep the company in business, rather than systems designed for the user.
Although Apple does this, Microsoft is the bigger example of this, it''s why they''re in court now. Using the power that ownership of the OS grants to force their wills in other areas of software and hardware, expanding off the desktop and even into things like television, toys, and soon, appliances.
I say we stop it right here. I''m fine if a company wants to better a Free OS, or write one of it''s own, but as soon as that company has full control of the system in the way Apple does, i want no part of it, when there are Free alternatives. Free Software is not only a moral issue, but it is also pragmatic. When the system is developed Freely (that''s capital-F), then people will only stick with the developers as long as they''re developing what the users want.
As i said, i don''t care if it''s comercially viable; i want a Free system, and i got one.
benc
Author
Thanks, Martee, for correcting me. Lately I''ve been a little too caught up in the hype. So what do you think about Apple releasing the kernel (and a few other components) as open source?
"If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away" --Henry David Thoreau
"If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away" --Henry David Thoreau
No problem 
I''m probably not the best person to answer your question, cuz I''m a bit biased against Macs...
Martee
Magnum Games
I''m probably not the best person to answer your question, cuz I''m a bit biased against Macs...
Martee
Magnum Games
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