quote: Original post by SwSh
I don''t know if Michalsons post was meant as a reply to mine, but if so: Let me quote myself: "Don''t understand me wrong: I don''t rationalise the problem of software piracy. It exists, it''s not good, people doing so have to be punished"
Clear?

Nope, I was just making a general response to the responses in the thread.

I''m using linux (red hat 9), gcc, opengl, jedit, make and blender3d.

I certainly see your point. I was piracing software for quite some years and when my morale picked up on me, I got to the decision where I either throw away windows with all the piracy software which you need to have to do something creative at all, or just install linux and use what''s free out there.

Sure, Visual Studio helps, but you can do just fine with GCC and a nice text editor anyway.

On windows, it isn''t really reality to actually produce something cool while doing it for free, since "everybody" has got the latest piracy software for you to use anyway... Yes, I''m aware of the fact that there are free compilers and blender for windows too, I''m just saying it isn''t standard practice to use it on windows.

Albert

quote: Original post by thec
On windows, it isn''t really reality to actually produce something cool while doing it for free, since "everybody" has got the latest piracy software for you to use anyway... Yes, I''m aware of the fact that there are free compilers and blender for windows too, I''m just saying it isn''t standard practice to use it on windows.

So? The software is available for windows and it should be used. For example, I have:

Windows 98 OEM that came with the computer
Borland C Builder 3 (free from a magizine cover disk)
GIMP for Windows (free download)
Blender (free download)
Anim8or (free download)
PovRay (free download)
CakeWalk (came with sound card)
ModPlug Tracker (free download)
Reason (very expensive)
OpenOffice.org (free download)
Office (expensive)

I agree that some of those are expensive, however there is nothing on that list that dosn''t have a free option. The fact of the matter is I have been able to develop for a very long time with all the free tools, and only now I am getting the more expensive tools. And even still, I am sticking with most of the free tools (Borland, GIMP, etc, because the benifits of more expensive tools do not justify their cost).

Having windows is no excuse, and if it was they can go get Linux. The tools are there, so don''t rip off some other poor (or even rich) developer.

Anyway, so what if it''s standard practice?? It dosn''t make it any less illegal.

Free Game: Yet Another Falling Block Game

just wanted to mention that I have stolen car for the fun of it!!!

About legal products :
Many have a poor manual. Another have a complex and hard-to-understand manual (examples Autocad).
No?
If the manual was really useable then you don''t need to buy another book (for example 3dsmax have a lot of books..). So, if someone say about to need a help (a newbie), he not necesary is a piracy!. In my case, i have the legal products but i preffer to ask in internet about it.

I have a lot of LEGAL products (because my business) BUT i don''t disagreed with the pirate, i''m not a lawyer to judged it, i''m NOT PAID for hunter pirates, i''m not interesting in it. In fact, i''m a programmer and i''m worry about MY and only my programs.

Ok, if some stupid say "where i can download 3dsmax", the it is good for ban but,if someone say "i need help" and you ban because you suppose... ¬¬

Finally, piracy or legal users not necesary is equal to good or bad user. I have many users with original software but they are really dumb with it.

In my country it is called a "caza de bruja" (witch hunter).. because they catch a true witch and also innocents.

quote: Original post by eng3d
Ok, if some stupid say "where i can download 3dsmax", the it is good for ban but,if someone say "i need help" and you ban because you suppose...

Didn''t I say that we''re not going to ban anyone just because they *might* have pirated software?

I think that when users pirate 3DMax, or Maya, for their own, non commercial use is beneficial for the economy.
Why? Because most of them buy books, and then they learn how to use those programs, so they can get hired by companies who payed for them. If very few people would pirate 3DMax or Maya, for example, they would have to use the free equivalent tools, because no one (I am talking about beginners) would spend 5K USD for a product that is not vital for them. So then most of the companies would be forced to use free tools too, because it''s the free tools people can use.
Instead, the makers of the expensive programs should have a really cheap (50-100 USD) version of their expensive programs, but require people NOT to use them for commercial stuff.

Height Map Editor | Eternal Lands | Fast User Directory

Please don''t come to a software development forum and try to justify stealing software. As far as your arguement goes, almost all of the major players have FREE learning editions and yet people still steal software.

Then there are other alternatives, there is software in the couple of hundred dollar range like Bryce, Rhino, Truespace, Animation Master, etc. Then there are many apps that are even cheaper such as 3D Canvas and Milkshape. And still there are the open source choices like Wings, Blender, Art of Illusion, etc.

And yet with all these not so expensive alternatives, piracy is still a problem.

Bottom line piracy is illegal and there is not arugment that you can make that will justify it.

quote: Original post by yspotua
Please don''t come to a software development forum and try to justify stealing software. As far as your arguement goes, almost all of the major players have FREE learning editions and yet people still steal software.

Free learning editions where you can''t even save your work. very cool and useful.

quote:
Then there are other alternatives, there is software in the couple of hundred dollar range like Bryce, Rhino, Truespace, Animation Master, etc. Then there are many apps that are even cheaper such as 3D Canvas and Milkshape. And still there are the open source choices like Wings, Blender, Art of Illusion, etc.

So if you know how to use Bryce you can use 3D Max?

quote:
And yet with all these not so expensive alternatives, piracy is still a problem.

Sure, it will always be.

quote:
Bottom line piracy is illegal and there is not arugment that you can make that will justify it.

So whatever is illegal is wrong?

Height Map Editor | Eternal Lands | Fast User Directory

By following your logic, Raduprv, I could steal a car, because I could never pay for it if I had to.

You want people to be able to learn 3Ds Max? This means learning the program as a tool. You know how to extrude, create objects, boxes, and all those little steps you can take while creating a model etc... Each of these commands can be done in seconds without having a prior model. You can even do it on a cube.

Now, of course, if you want to be able to learn how to put these steps together to create a model, you have to be able to save your work. But this is not using 3ds Max anymore, you can learn this on most 3D editors.

To your question, "If I can use Bryce, can I use 3DS Max?", I''ll answer simply: if you know how to create models using simple steps, then download a learning version of 3DS Max, learn how to do these steps, and you''ll know how to use 3DS Max.

He did not say whatever illegal is wrong. There even isn''t something that is truly wrong by universal standards - it''s all a matter of definition. However, this board intends to enforce the law by all means available to them, and it is not wrong to do so.