meanwhile someone said the word potatos and got rated up 4 or 5 times...........sorry but this place has gotten really immature in the lounge at least.

hey!

I have for years, youve been around for a month? I have a rating of 4, that must mean I don't help anyone actually work on games. What I'm getting at is the rating system is flawed in that I got voted down because I said something about how gamedev is picking on people with the rating system, meanwhile someone said the word potatos and got rated up 4 or 5 times...........sorry but this place has gotten really immature in the lounge at least.

It's immature to whine about the rating system, actually. It is what it is. It's crowd-sourced data, and thus it's subject to the whims of the crowd. Whining about it doesn't help any more than it helps a politician to whine about why they deserved to have won an election.

You say you've been around for years. How many years could it possibly be? Judging from your posts I'd say you're, what, 13? 14?

[color="#1C2837"]That's your opinion and that's fine, but the rating system is there for people to approve or disapprove of a post - like it or not, what's the point of whining on 'losers'?

[color="#1C2837"]No it is to approve/disapprove of people, if what you are saying is true, a negative post wouldn't carry to a person. I've helped a lot of people, but my rating wouldn't say so. Right now this site has turned into a popularity war with this new rating system and does nothing but bum some people out when people start giving thumbs down. It is discouraging to new members that have no experience and need to ask their first game dev question, which this may have been. This guy has 17 total posts and was on game development topic.

[color="#1c2837"]I'll bet that all of my first questions would have 20 thumbs down because I simply started my career on here alone and not in school.

[color="#1c2837"]Again its discouraging. I don't like how the new comers are treated. Popularity in terms of 'cool' posts means nothing.

[color="#1c2837"]And you also gotta love the "you should google this/that", there is a whole resource of people here that when you don't understand, you can ask. When did it become negative to ask real people in real time vs read some old document on google?
[/quote]

When I started out, I had six months of lurking before I posted anything. Why? Was I scared? No. Not really. I just didn't feel the need to ask "OMGF! WHAT LANGUAGE IS TEH HAXXORZ?!" or other nonsense - I took my time and searched. I learnt the way I've learnt anything - I did my research, paused, tried to grasp it and then, and only then, did I ask a question if I had any. Rinse and repeat. I promise you, any beginner who takes the time to...
A) do their own research (don't be a lazy ass, the archives are there for a reason and it's not for the amusement of the servers)
B) use proper grammar (no one will nitpick on 'then' and 'than' but if i write liek tis I might just get a somewhat negative or confused reaction
C) make sure to do a quick search using Google or GD's own search (literally takes five minutes, promise!) to see that the question hasn't been asked before into redundancy (for example, "best language" returns 1000 results with 40 pages to scroll through on GD's own search - gee, what ever would happen if we took our time to do that before posting a language thread?). Doing the same on Google returns 78,800 in 0.21 seconds!


...anyone who does all that will have respect around here from day one. Promise.

I don't see anyone being treated differently for being new or not; I see people being treated differently for approaching things in different ways. So yeah, if you are an arrogant brat be prepared for the flame. That's the way it is in real life too, you know. Treating people like crap won't give you much in the way of good favor with anyone. Hell, even asking redundant questions is usually treated with grace over here so what more could you ask for? That we kiss their asses and bow before our new masters. On second thought, let's do that!


...and finally, no one is putting a heavy emphasis on the rating system other than you. I don't perceive anything you say as less worth for having a low rating. Sure enough, it might lower the chance of me reading your post if it has a -10 rep but that also indicates you either a) said something highly offensive or b) said something incredibly stupid or c) something very unpopular. Of course, sometimes you get downrates for no other reason than revenge or silly people being silly. My question is: why does that bother you? Because I've'nt seen evidence of beginners being bullied out on the forum on a regular basis yet - if you have some specific thread that pained you to see or feel that users are being asses and want to discuss, feel free to PM me or carry on the discussion here in public. But don't hammer on the same way HazePhaze did with only anecdotes as your backup.

Btw, so you don't say that 'many who start out are young' or similar bulls***t - I started when I was eight and I was a stupid ass retard. Still I managed to understand enough not to go around acting like I own the place. You know what? I was pretty damn respected back then by the people who were a ton smarter than me and they knew they were - why? Because I had shown the understanding that I was the new kid on the block and there were rules to be learnt. I broke them, for sure, many times - but I learned for my mistakes. Eventually I came back. New username and new face, not because I was afraid that people would remember me as an ass or anything but just because I felt GD was starting over and well, so had I. But you know what? I agree with you. The rep system shouldn't be universally applied to a user like it is now. But that's for another thread - time to go looking for the feedback thread on this...

Again, I say this because this guy has only a few posts, so I'm not sure why you are saying I'm doing this, when some other people are doing the following:

[color=#1C2837][size=2]Treating people like crap won't give you much in the way of good favor with anyone.[/quote]
[color=#1C2837][size=2]Everyone is picking on the guy who posted this.
[color=#1C2837][size=2]

[color=#1C2837][size=2]

[color=#1C2837][size=2]no one is putting a heavy emphasis on the rating system other than you.[/quote]
[color="#1c2837"]Well no, you guys are cuz your rating this guy down. If I join a game dev sight and ask about making my own engine vs using UDK, and everyone rates me down, then I might not want to contribute to that community. As I just said I had a 0 rating, my emphasis on rating is 0. BUT for new people who are young, maybe it is for them. Stop picking on people that want to learn.
[color="#1c2837"]

[color="#1c2837"]

[color=#1C2837][size=2]Still I managed to understand enough not to go around acting like I own the place[/quote]
[color=#1C2837][size=2]Who is doing this?
[color="#1c2837"]

[color="#1c2837"]

[color=#1C2837][size=2]You say you've been around for years. How many years could it possibly be? Judging from your posts I'd say you're, what, 13? 14? [/quote]
[color="#1c2837"]http://www.gamedev.net/topic/604189-shader-problem/ Look I help people, thats all I'm here to do. I enjoy helping people because they have helped me. If your here to rate people down for asking questions RELATED to game dev, then that is dumb.

Gee, my rating just plummeted! From 36 or so to 12, and right after I criticized dpadam450! All the posts in my history have a -1 even most of them used to be 0! How could that have happened?

Is it possible that this guy who's calling other people immature just went through my post history (and posts completely unrelated to this one) and rated my posts down? NO! No way that someone would be so hypocritical to so immaturely use a system that he himself is asking people to be more mature with.

No way you'd be that hypocritical and immature, right dpadam450? LOL

You take my reputation down, that's wonderful. I get to continue living my life not caring about it, while you have to live your sad little life being a baby who lashes out vindictively when grownups are mean to him, and on the internet no less

I did it cuz u said it didnt matter. I just wanted to see you actually post about it because I'm sticking up for the guy you rated down, because it was enough for you post about your rating going down then MAYBE it was enough for the original poster of the thread to feel mistreated. Sure it was childish, AND immature, and I stopped, but it proved a point.

In general my personal observation has been that the rating system works overall. I have specific issues with the new incarnation but I will not go into that here. While some people feel picked on (and that does sometimes happen if they get entangled in the wrong discussion with a certain less mature crowd) the non-thread-local and persistent drops in rating usually have observable deeper-lying issues. Among those are often (unthinking) arrogance, disrespect towards people who want to help them, advanced advice resistance, name-calling, inability to support opinions with verifiable facts even when asked to, deliberate butchering of the English language, statement of half-truths or talking about things they don't really understand. The list is not complete but I think the educated reader can continue it.

Regarding your rating in particular dpadam450, let's look at your entry to this thread:

People that rate other people online are whinning losers.

Calling everyone (including people who take great pains to rate carefully and responsible) 'whining losers' is not exactly a good start and unlikely to sway opinion towards you. Looking at your immediate post history I see at least one other occurrence of unnecessary sweeping statements and inadvisable coarse language. I also have some other bad memories attached to your name over the years but I don't see the need for going gravedigging in old threads.

Yea it was because of political threads, not how much I helped people in OpenGL (which is the thread I stick in, though it has been a lot less lately).

Unfortunately, it does not allow "grave digging". I wanted to view an old topic that I replied to for revived information, but it only gives me like my last 5 threads/posts. Can this get fixed? I have several times gone back to read someones ideas that I knew were somewhere I posted. And of course it was too generic to use the forum search.

Well the topic might read a little confusing,so ill explain.Since ive been on gamedev all ive seen is people recommend others to just design they're own engine.Dont get me wrong im not saying that its bad but as the saying goes "time is money".So the longer you waste on making a horrid engine you could use the leading free engines out right now.I'll name a few engines you could use or even start off with by editing yourself completely and making it yourself.

UDK is a great example of a engine to use for FPS like games,im not to sure about it going into a RPG but would be time consuming.Remember folks time is money and having to spend more then 5months on a engine you wanna design yourself cause you wanna feel "PRO" is just completely dumb.

Unity 3D flexible,great to start off with,extremely easy to use just like the UDK and you can find a high amount of tuts all over the tuts.

Engines you can use to build from
i only have one so rage if you want but this is the only one i found updated and open sourced.Doom Engine or the Eternity Engine.I can link you to it,this engine was used for DragonNest so thats a good thing but its missing a high amount of things but its great on tools so your lucky on that.

Now what grinds my gears really is the whole "be pro make your own engine" and then if you dont do it you get negative rep.We're indie game designers,its hard to believe but we are basely a community not just solo acts like big companys.We dont need to compete right now cause we can help each other out of the kindness of our hearts.Ive seen such horrid advice giving like "make 2D" yes 2d is amazing and fun but a company like steam does not what a copy of angry birds done to death back on they're shelves with horrid graphics and that wont sell.I made this thread to hear what you suppose "Pro"s have to say about me advising the beginners to use engines like unity and UDK.Also i want to hear your side.BTW Steam announced they'd stop 2D games from going into they're market.

Note:i expect you to come on here with a open mind not a narrow mind fan boy of 2d games and of self coder of a engine.

If you agree awesome if some dont to each his own but in the end when you coming crying on GameDev crying about why your game looks like trash and why does everyone make a game so quickly with such high quality models and maps.Its simple cause we use Company made engines and we didnt waste our time on designing our own engine.

ok i never said that UDK wasnt good for RPG's cause im pretty sure i said this

"[color="#1C2837"]UDK is a great example of a engine to use for FPS like games,im not to sure about it going into a RPG, but it would be time consuming."
[color="#1C2837"]time consuming coding wise...

[color="#1C2837"]now to the guy that was all anal about the correction from steam to valve is extremely dumb to nitpick at what im saying.Its like being a grammar nazi its just a sad thing to do...I do have in my right to speak my opinion and i find those that make they're own engines are wasting times.But i did not say its wrong for them to make a engine.Just a waste of time when they could be using the UDK or Unity or whatever else engine thats out there.By the time they finish a engine on pair to unity or even the UDK they could of made more then 1 game and have had hired people to help him finish the engine or just buy the engine in itself and then build from that engine.As for the link to the valve thing i will let my friend come on here and link you since he saved the wonderful link.Have a fit idc but i dont have the link currently since i dont make it my day by filling my bookmarks with steam news.

[color="#1C2837"](If you wanna be anal about it valve)

[color="#1c2837"]Also i have been on here for awhile now and ive seen people advise beginners to just design they're own engine or game in C++ which makes me double face palm my face.I find it distasteful that you would tell a noob to jump on such a project of that magnitude.And by you i mean some of the gamedev people.

ok well ill repeat what ive said about the steam thing i dont save everything they update on, my friend linked it to me once read it and tossed it.I dont save these things cause i dont find it useful.I wouldnt make such a thing up i wouldnt gain anything from it and i really dont care if people want to design 2D games that look worse then a ping pong game made straight from C++...Im not trying to be rude and if you are saying your new here you do realize that alot of things get deleted and tossed around in this forum.I wont be linking anyone or anything you will soon see the sadness i have seen.I can easily also say that gamedev is the sure place to go if you wanna get encouraged to make a 2D game instead of a 3D game.Ive seen these people post on these forums and it makes me sad to see such a waste who knows if they're stuff could be the next big thing but they rather waste it on making they're own engine.

asking for links will get you no where cause i will not just simply go through everything to prove what ive said.I have no reason to lie at all and i dont really care if people think i am.I dont lose any sleep at all.

to me it just seems like you guys want to get attention and just flame me for making the point that those that advise others to design a engine or choose to work on a engine.If thats trolling then sure ok haha,btw please stay ontopic your responses just seems like you wanna be cool and make me seem like a jackA$#.But in truth what you say does not phase me,not in the slightest.Get ontopic or get out,or just let the thread die.

Avert your eyes if you dont like what i gotta say or negative rep me haha i dont care.

ill make a example of what ive seen and if you havent found it well meh.Dont believe me ? well i really dont care.Ive seen it,im not saying its bad to not make the engine or to not start on one.Plainly saying that its time consuming and is kinda pointless when and if your game makes a large amount of money you can easily just get the UDK and fuse it with Cry Engine.Or you can fuse your UDK (once you ofcourse have bought the full engine) to your first engine you were building on your off time.Reread what ive said its not really complicated and ive had to repeat myself a lot so ya lol.

[quote name='RedPin' timestamp='1308126300' post='4823530']
Search through the threads, it's not hard. Many people have posted about this. Stop trolling because you see someone come on here randomly that can't seem to use Google or the advanced search feature correctly. I have found a lot of content about people making their own game engines, both 2d and 3d on here, and also threads where people ("elite programmers") telling others that they need full control over their game engine to fix bugs that might not come. By the majority of bigots posting here about how negative he was, I see that most don't even have anything to show but save 1 person. The problem is your attitude, and your ability to use "Search" buttons and functions correctly. What's so hard about that? And the Steam thing, the ceo had the statement retracted, so you won't be able to find it unless you dig through Google Cache. It was also a posted outsource link on here, and it disappeared over a week's span.

So in total, we learned you can't use the search tools, and you can't seem to be positive. Steam doesn't want horrible games, and like I'll quote from a older thread "this isn't a community to be innovative, but just a place for us to find help if we need it."

Enough said
[/quote]

Yes, because clearly the above is not arrogant, childish or stupid at all! No sir, it is you who is either blind or just unwilling to yield - the above lacks coherence, he turns to tell us how things 'should be done' and then he insults us 'supposed pros' (oh?) and then goes on to say he 'really doesn't care' which just nullifies the point of the entire thread. No grammar + no effort + no coherence = downrate. Is that really so hard to understand? Which brings me to my second point: what was the point of this thread? Also, picking? PICKING?! How on earth can you know whether 'we guys' rated him down or not? Hell, it could be you as well for all I know. So stop acting all high and mighty - if you are part of the community as long as you say why are you saying things like 'you guys'? Not much for community spirit, hm?

I've been here since 2001. So, dpadam450 how long have you? This isn't an e-peen contest. Like I said, I don't give a damn about the rating. The OP doesn't give a damn. You have bone to pick and you chose this thread. I'm bowing out; I won't help ending this thread faster by keeping up this nonsense since, clearly, you aren't interested in debate.

[color="#1c2837"]If I join a game dev sight and ask about making my own engine vs using UDK, and everyone rates me down, then I might not want to contribute to that community.

Except, you know, that DOESNT happen.

If someone turns up and asks such a question then what is likely to happen is you'll get some people who say 'you UDK and make a game', some who'll say 'using C#/XNA' and a few who'll decide that 'doing everything' is the best way. The arguement then tends to break out over which way is best until a mod comes along to restore order or close the topic off.

Now, if someone turns up, declares they are making an engine, gets encourged otherwise and then goes on a rant about how everyone is wrong and stupid etc etc THEN those posts might well get voted down.

But I've never seen anyone being rated down for asking a question like that in a reasonable way.

And on the subject of 'mods restoring order or closing the topic off' this has gone too far already...