Advertisement

Academia stretched thin (rant)

Started by February 09, 2011 07:00 PM
26 comments, last by way2lazy2care 13 years, 8 months ago

Now, I don't expect a long winded explanation about what was wrong, but does it really take all that long to circle a problem and scribble "See theory X" or whatever is suitable to it?
Some students want it, but many do not. It is almost always a waste of time to do what you explained.

My experiences both as a TA and lab assistant last century probably still apply, I doubt the eduction system has changed that much. MOST students understand the theory or know where to look for it. MOST students have a fairly good understanding of the concepts and use the exams and assignments to help cement the learning. MOST students only need a tiny bit of guidance, and will seek it out themselves. MOST students are able to find and correct the mistakes on their own after knowing the answer is wrong or not expected.

VERY FEW students honestly don't get it or cannot correct the mistakes on their own, and those students will either drop out or come visit in person. Back in my college days these represented fewer than 5% of the class, generally 1:30 or even 1:50.

It sounds like you are a member of the small group who needs that bit of extra help.

The fact that I went to University rather than a public Library is, to me at least, a pretty damn clear sign that I WANT feed back, and to be told where I'm going wrong. Not having that feed back just wastes everyone's time. it means I have to go track down the professor and hope they aren't busy, possibly working my schedule around a meeting time, then the prof has to go and read the assignment again, think about it before giving me the initial reply of what was wrong. Then usually I would thank them and leave to first go try to solve the problem myself. If I can't work it out on my own, then I have to go back.

That is a lot of steps cut out if they just gave that initial feedback in the first place, and saves both of us a meeting.
[/quote]Your stated view of academics is very different from the view I had both in undergrad and graduate studies. It is different from what I observed in the faculty. And it is different from what I observed in the student body at both of the schools I attended.


University studies it not about being told where you are going wrong. Even if you disagree with the professors, they are educated enough to know that there is still a possibility that you are right. They are educated enough to understand that what is right and wrong is debatable, and if you disagree with them you are expected to discuss it. The very concept of "saving you both a meeting" to discuss a concept is somewhat contrary to the nature of University education. The entire point is to meet together and logically argue and discuss the topics under study, so that everybody grows from the experience.

Students are expected to learn ON THEIR OWN. The primary job of the professors is to help guide the students down a path, and to answer questions whey they get stuck. It is not their job to spoon-feed the information to students.

The best professors I had would only one lecture. It was the first day of the course and he explained what was expected. Generally on the second day of class he asked if there were any questions on the assigned material. When nobody raised their hand, he gave out a quiz on the material. Once it was collected he stated the assignment for the next day, and asked if there were questions. When there were no questions, he dismissed class. The second day of class would typically only last about 10 minutes. First-time students were confused by this, expecting a lecture even though he clearly explained the first day that he expected the students to learn on their own and use the class as a forum for discussion. Over time everyone learns that the time for class is a time for discussion of the details that aren't explained in the required reading, and that students are encouraged to bring in knowledge from other books and other fields, and to help each other. These types of classes tend to be far more instructive on the field than a series of daily lectures.

If you learn only one skill from university studies, that skill should be the ability to learn and study on your own. It is a basic skill that university graduates are expected to have. That skill is why finishing the program is more important than the content of the program, and why I'd rather have a college graduate in an unrelated field than a non-graduate.
If someone doesn't want to help students learn and become useful members of their fields, then they should stay the hell out of academics. They're not helping the students, and they're wasting our time and our money.[/quote]University education is not job training. If that is what you want, go to a trade school.
Since you prefer the style of feedback provided to me on my assignment, allow me to offer my response to your latest post in that format. Here it is:



Schedule a meeting with me if you have questions, but I presume that only 1:50 people reading this thread have any confusion over my points above.
Advertisement
Man I really hate teachers like that OP. I gripe I had is why are we required to attend classes? I'm paying the professor's salary in the form of a $40,000 tuition to reserve my seat in the class, but what says I have to be there? For example, my university is requiring me to take Calculus I even though I have received a 5 on the AP exam and that class is BORINGG. So if I could better use my time to do contract work and still pass the tests (which I do), then what's the problem...
</rant>
Denzel Morris (@drdizzy) :: Software Engineer :: SkyTech Enterprises, Inc.
"When men are most sure and arrogant they are commonly most mistaken, giving views to passion without that proper deliberation which alone can secure them from the grossest absurdities." - David Hume

Man I really hate teachers like that OP. I gripe I had is why are we required to attend classes? I'm paying the professor's salary in the form of a $40,000 tuition to reserve my seat in the class, but what says I have to be there? For example, my university is requiring me to take Calculus I even though I have received a 5 on the AP exam and that class is BORINGG. So if I could better use my time to do contract work and still pass the tests (which I do), then what's the problem...
</rant>


This reminds me of my thinking when I went to school....

"Let me get this straight, to get a BS in CS I have to take approximately 20 classes that have absolutely zero to do with my major... another 10 or so classes which I'll never ever use... that leaves me with... /me counts on his fingers... 5 to 10 classes that are worth anything."

I ended up just taking the classes I was interested in. Cutting out the fat and saving $25,000 (in state tuition, lucky me).

I don't have the paper, but paper won't do you much good, specially in this economy... Which leads me to the old cliche, It's not about what you know, but who you know.
486ing for life

http://www.gearcity.info/
http://www.ventdev.com/

University education is not job training. If that is what you want, go to a trade school.


So you have never run into that professor who doesn't have time to explain something he said in his lecture that was different from his notes/the textbook, is late to class, or rarely, if ever, in his office during posted office hours?


Also, you also think that someone would honestly hand in a finished assignment, and know "Oh, I don't understand the principal behind this part, but I'll just go off and review it after I get the grade back"?

I have had a few really bad professors who have expected students to show up to every lecture (They sent around a sign in sheet, and being to every lecture was like 10% of the grade.) and you were lucky to even get a mark on your assignments before the final exam, or even see the back of his head outside of lectures. And you are going to tell me someone like that is at all useful to learning? The price I paid for a class like that would have done a hell of a lot more good to me buying a wider array of textbooks.
Old Username: Talroth
If your signature on a web forum takes up more space than your average post, then you are doing things wrong.
Why not just send the TA an email?
Advertisement

Students are expected to learn ON THEIR OWN. The primary job of the professors is to help guide the students down a path, and to answer questions whey they get stuck. It is not their job to spoon-feed the information to students.



I couldn't disagree with you more on this. The job of a professor isn't to tell people "you're wrong, any questions?". Their job is to teach. That's what they're paid to do. That's what I paid my college professors to do and for the most part they did it. If I had wanted to learn on my own, I would have gone to a library and saved myself some money. I could have learned everything I did in college from some books, but it would have taken me a hell of a lot longer.

It's not the job of the students to learn everything on their own (while paying good money!) and spoon-feed the professors an easy job.

I don't have the paper, but paper won't do you much good, specially in this economy.

paper can get your resume through prescreening, which will do you a lot more good than not having one in this economy.

Maybe you should have picked a major where the focus was actually on the major instead of on general education. According to your assessment I took more major courses in one semester than you had in your entire program. I can't in good conscience believe that was really the case unless you were a liberal arts major, in which case what were you expecting?

This topic is closed to new replies.

Advertisement