nudity in games, and making out with boys

makeshiftwings · 2004-05-05T20:58:09

i''ve been thinking about this topic mostly because of an ongoing argument on the Morrowind boards. For those who aren''t aware, Morrowind''s an RPG by Bethesda, the sequel to Arena and Daggerfall. Now Daggerfall gave you the interesting ability to take the clothes off your character in the item screen, leading to lots of fun staring at pixelated dark elf breasts. Also there were various naked women standing around in towns for no apparent reason. In Morrowind, they decided there would be no nudity. Many people are outraegd, claiming that Morrowind is now aiming to please the kiddies, and not the "mature" audience that daggerfall was allegedly aiming for with its gratuitous elf porn. Now, in my opinion, I see their decision of no nudity as being MORE mature. I admit, back when i was 14, nudity seemed very adult at the time, probably because it was always behind labels that said "Adults only". But i feel that games that are filled with nudity or almost-nudity *cough* *cough* *Everquest* *cough* are really just pandering to the hormonal teenagers. The romances in the Black Isle games (Baldur''s Gate 2, Planescape...) seemed much more mature to me, and were actually enjoyable, as opposed to the random scantily clad girls in most games, which mostly make me feel like everyone was right when they said video games are for kids. Also, in my life, I generally try to uphold such Chaotic Good beliefs as feminism and gay rights; but games sometimes seem to be developed by a horde of homophobic chauvinists. Then again, I suppose most of the suburban teenage male population is a horde of homophobic chauvinists, and developers are just catering to their audience. I for one, know a lot of gamers that would have a fatal heart attack if they found out their battle-hardened space marine was going around kissing boys, though I myself would be thrilled to see something like that in a game. Back on the Morrowind boards, with the nudity issue, there was also the general consensus that it was only really important that attractive naked women be in the game, as "no one wants to see naked guys". Also in games that have had nudity, the female form is generally pretty anatomically correct (well except for the fact that they''re always shaped like barbie dolls), while the male form generally has a suspicious blurry looking splotch between his legs. Now, I''m not saying we should all release games with lots of naked guys running around, I''m just trying to make a point that nudity in games isn''t actually there for "realism" or "artistic reasons" as some people want to believe, it''s really just some naked chicks to keep the teenage boys interested. So, ideas? Can nudity and sex be included tastefully, perhaps even artistically, into a game? Should we, as designers, even try, or should we not bother including it at all? Or maybe just put some porn in to help the game sell (not an option for me persnoally) ? Would gamers in general even play Killfest 6000 if the main character was acting suspiciously gay during the opening sequence? By the way, I''ve noticed that some games do in fact have lesbians, as i guess they''re more accepted by the gaming audience than gay boys. Still, most of the portrayal of such is still very porn oriented, except for the great lesbian couple in The Longest Journey, which is one of the only games that I felt actually had viable female characters in it. Well, could this post be any longer?

Game Design and Theory Game Design

Started by makeshiftwings August 24, 2001 11:41 PM

29 comments, last by makeshiftwings 20 years, 9 months ago

__Daedalus__

480

May 05, 2004 09:55 AM

It should be integral to the plot. You shouldn''t have nudity for nuditys sake. But if you wanted to make a game where one of the main character get killed, say, taking a shower - you wouldn''t have them in the shower with their clothes on would you!

irbrian

130

May 05, 2004 10:18 AM

I do not believe these situations should enter games or film, for the simple but very important reason that I believe intimacy is a very private act reserved for a man and a woman within the bonds of marriage. We all know it happens, and that it should happen under those conditions, but I do not believe it is something that should be discussed in these kinds of public settings. Furthermore, I find crass and informal discussions of the topic to be a gross violation of the sacred nature of it.

Sadly, I would be surprised to learn that more than a few of you share this belief.

****************************************

Brian Lacy
ForeverDream Studios

Comments? Questions? Curious?

"I create. Therefore I am."

---------------------------Brian Lacy"I create. Therefore I am."

Indeterminatus

129

May 05, 2004 10:23 AM

quote:

Original post by ZenDarva:
Am i the only person amused that it seems that the more open minded the position espoused in the post, the better written it seems to be?

::cough cough::

Nudity bad. Nudity very bad. Nuttin' that bad as nudity.

Seriously now ... Now that this seems to be a very interesting topic for some of you, I just can't help to add my 2 cents

.
Although I haven't played Tomb Raider (which came up a few times), I don't see any disadvantages in creating a sexy character. If that's a reason for the game being played and bought, there's nothing bad about it, or is it?
I have the impression that's the key for successful games. Either have an excellent plot, or stuff your game with some gore or porn .
If I was the one that couldn't think of a good story, I'd choose the other way...and I believe there are players who do not care about the depth of a game, as long as it's brutal or they can stare at some "nude pixels" on the screen ...

edit: forgot to close the quote tag...

Indeterminatus

--si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses--

[edited by - Indeterminatus on May 5, 2004 11:24:47 AM]

Indeterminatus--si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses--

BitMaster

8,652

May 05, 2004 10:48 AM

quote:
Original post by irbrian
Sadly, I would be surprised to learn that more than a few of you share this belief.

Considering that there are a lot of Europeans here it would indeed be very surprising if you were surprised.

[edited by - BitMaster on May 5, 2004 11:48:39 AM]

OOCCO

100

May 05, 2004 10:58 AM

quote:
Original post by irbrian
I do not believe these situations should enter games or film, for the simple but very important reason that I believe intimacy is a very private act reserved for a man and a woman within the bonds of marriage. We all know it happens, and that it should happen under those conditions, but I do not believe it is something that should be discussed in these kinds of public settings. Furthermore, I find crass and informal discussions of the topic to be a gross violation of the sacred nature of it.

Sadly, I would be surprised to learn that more than a few of you share this belief.

****************************************

Brian Lacy
ForeverDream Studios

Comments? Questions? Curious?

"I create. Therefore I am."

Well I think your beliefs are draconian and provincial but fundamental to a hopeless romanticist.

"The Holocaust was an obscene period in our nation's history. I mean in this century's history. But we all lived in this century. I didn't live in this century."...Governor George W. Bush, 9/15/95

atcdevil

145

May 05, 2004 12:24 PM

quote:
Original post by irbrian
I do not believe these situations should enter games or film, for the simple but very important reason that I believe intimacy is a very private act reserved for a man and a woman within the bonds of marriage. We all know it happens, and that it should happen under those conditions, but I do not believe it is something that should be discussed in these kinds of public settings. Furthermore, I find crass and informal discussions of the topic to be a gross violation of the sacred nature of it.

Sadly, I would be surprised to learn that more than a few of you share this belief.

****************************************

Brian Lacy
ForeverDream Studios

Comments? Questions? Curious?

"I create. Therefore I am."

Sacred? That sounds like some religious thing O_O

There's nothing wrong with doing it if you're just doing it for fun. As long as the other person (guy or girl whatever your preference) is down. You're certainly not hurting anyone... And you know it feels dammmmmmn good.

[edited by - atcdevil on May 5, 2004 1:26:09 PM]

[edited by - atcdevil on May 5, 2004 1:26:45 PM]

RuneLancer

253

May 05, 2004 01:52 PM

This thread has been necroed.

Even then, I don''t see why it should be closed. Ah well, let the mods have their fun and ruins everyone else''s.

My belief is that nudity in games should not occure if the game isn''t targetted at a mature audience. Last thing we want are a bunch of lamers running around with nude characters just because they can. It isn''t necessary to getting the game to work and be fun (unless it''s some kind of orgy sim or something, but then again if that''s targetted at a non-mature audience, there''s a problem somewhere along the line) and it just causes immature people to take it the wrong way (ie, to mess around with it, not to complain; don''t mean to flame people here ^^; )

In a mature game, then I fail to see the issue. Although there''s still a difference between gratious (sp?) sex scenes and realism. If, for some reason, your female wood elf can wear a bra that increases her defense, and you can remove/add equipment in your character screen, I see no problem there. But if all female characters in a game are, for whatever reason it may be, dressed in little more than a bra and panties (ie, the traditional chainmail-bikini), the game is just dumb.

On the other hand, such a game could easily appeal to the male crowd, which takes up a huge share of the gaming market. Sex sells, after all...

Cibressus

100

May 05, 2004 03:13 PM

alex in half life 2 is a perfect example of women in video games done right. she''s dressed like a normal woman would dress (atleast somewhat) and she is''nt thier just to look good. i caught my self swimming in tomb raider a number of times just to watch larua open her legs.

| Member of UBAAG (Unban aftermath Association of Gamedev)

Anonymous

May 05, 2004 03:44 PM

And that crawl animation... yowza!!!

This thread took a long time to read, and is filled with anachronisms, and is necroed from four years ago. Close it, and if you want to talk about this issue, start a new thread with a link and some contemporary examples.

RuneLancer

253

May 05, 2004 05:07 PM

quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
Close it, and if you want to talk about this issue, start a new thread with a link and some contemporary examples.

Why start a new thread when we''re already using this one? It''s the single stupidest thing I''ve ever seen on these forums, with no intended disrespect...

nudity in games, and making out with boys

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