For what it's worth, I think the main reasons we should reduce the amount of fossil fuels we burn is not to reduce climate change effects, but a)to reduce pollution and b)to conserve what are finite resources.

Quote: Original post by trzy
My personal sense is that spoiled Westerners are flocking to the global warming crusade to reclaim a sense of purpose in their otherwise pointless existence.

And what, in your opinion, motivates the global warming deniers? Do you divine any similar character defects or emotional forces responsible for their position?

Quote: Original post by Trapper Zoid

Quote: Original post by Eelco
There is no point in trying to err on the side of caution, if you dont even know what the side of caution is.

Sorry, I'm not sure I'm following your argument. Are you arguing that global warming might be a good thing for the planet, in that it will lead to a more favourable weather distribution?

It's an interesting argument, although I'd like to see what benefits the experts predict.

Elitist! If the speculations and misinformation peddling of random fools on the internet isn't good enough for you, then you're in the wrong place.

Quote: Original post by d000hg
Firstly, if you're going to satirise something, perhaps you'd best make sure we know what the hell you're on about [wink]

Quote: Original post by Hodgman
Australia just got it's first major politician who doesn't believe in global warming :/
He's not even just one of the ones that doesn't believe in the link between human actions and changing climate, but he actually denies that climate change is occurring whatsoever.

I guarantee you he's not the only one or the first. Although those talking about GW & CC on TV like to smoothly say "only deranged loons deny global warming", that's plainly not true.
I'm a member of a forum for professional IT contractors and several people there strongly think the governments have jumped on the CC bandwagon to win votes and distract the population from bigger problems - it would be too un-PC for anyone not to adhere to what we're told about CC.

I'm not in that group, myself, but I've seen them discussing things like "if CC is so obviously true, why has global average temperature dropped over the last few years?" I've no idea about the factual backing for their arguments, but that's not my point... climate change is disputed much more widely than the media reports.

Are you kidding? I hope you don't intend your example to be some sort evidence of this claim (about media reporting), even assuming that you're willing to concede its anecdotal nature and the worth of anecdotal evidence.

Quote: Original post by BerwynIrish

Quote: Original post by Trapper Zoid

Quote: Original post by Eelco
There is no point in trying to err on the side of caution, if you dont even know what the side of caution is.

Sorry, I'm not sure I'm following your argument. Are you arguing that global warming might be a good thing for the planet, in that it will lead to a more favourable weather distribution?

It's an interesting argument, although I'd like to see what benefits the experts predict.

Elitist! If the speculations and misinformation peddling of random fools on the internet isn't good enough for you, then you're in the wrong place.

Eloquent.

Quote: Original post by BerwynIrish

Quote: Original post by trzy
My personal sense is that spoiled Westerners are flocking to the global warming crusade to reclaim a sense of purpose in their otherwise pointless existence.

And what, in your opinion, motivates the global warming deniers? Do you divine any similar character defects or emotional forces responsible for their position?

It depends. In the broadest sense, the "deniers" do not want to see sweeping policy decisions made on an speculative and still evolving scientific hypothesis. They don't want to be made to feel guilty about the tremendous improvement in their lives that has been made over the course of the last century nor do they want to slow or impede the tremendous inroads globalization has made over the last few decades, lifting hundreds of millions out of poverty and increasing their life spans.

A local columnist where I live once wrote about feeling "guilty" for buying organic strawberries from Trader Joe's and an Indian rug because neither were locally made and therefore increased his "CO2 footprint." Talk about a real-life living, breathing "Stuff White People Like" caricature...

Anyway, I'm off to Lalaland for a short vacation. I'm terribly sorry, but I'll be taking a jet plane and have not purchased carbon offsets. ;)

It's very easy to see what people can gain from denying climate change. It means there would not have to be all these damn regulations on emissions, higher taxes on fuels etc.

I certainly agree that a lot of the reaction to GW is band-wagon jumping by politicians - whether GW is real is largely irrelevant to how they decide their actions.

Quote: Original post by d000hg
It's very easy to see what people can gain from denying climate change. It means there would not have to be all these damn regulations on emissions, higher taxes on fuels etc.

Good to see this thread stayed on topic.

Quote: Original post by Hodgman
Don't you reckon that denying that getting shot by a gun causes any damage whatsoever is outrageous enough to obviously be some kind of 'failed attempt at humor'?

Normally, a person should think that ..... but, sadly, I've seen far more ridiculous things being posted on the internet which were supposedly not attempts at humor.

Quote: Original post by HostileExpanse

Quote: Original post by Hodgman
Don't you reckon that denying that getting shot by a gun causes any damage whatsoever is outrageous enough to obviously be some kind of 'failed attempt at humor'?

Normally, a person should think that ..... but, sadly, I've seen far more ridiculous things being posted on the internet which were supposedly not attempts at humor.

Space tubes!