I am a bit dissapointed that the OP as a german is not asking something more adequate, like Delta Force vs. Kommando Spezialkräfte, or German Commando Frogmen vs. SEAL's.

(As a former soldier of the Bundesmarine in basic military service, I'd be more interested in the latter.)

Quote: Original post by Talroth

SWAT police is trained to 'pick' civilians in a civilian enviroment and bring them to justice, they attemp to diffuse a situation and use force as last resort. Military will take less precautions when it comes to dealing with hostile targets. That's why things like friendly fire are comon in a combat situation. Soldiers aren't trained to hesitate.

Quote: Original post by Calin

Quote: Original post by Talroth

SWAT police is trained to 'pick' civilians in a civilian enviroment and bring them to justice, they attemp to diffuse a situation and use force as last resort. Military will take less precautions when it comes to dealing with hostile targets. That's why things like friendly fire are comon in a combat situation. Soldiers aren't trained to hesitate.

Please don't make blanket statements. Relaxing situations is part of every basic military training, at least in germany. Of course, not always to the degree achieved by special forces like KSK, Delta Force or SWAT. And like SWAT, military units are also trained to diffuse situations. And, urban fighting will take place on the same ground for police and military, and are trained extensively by both.

Hostage rescuing is essentially the same, except that military rescue missions will often take place on a dangerous and highly risky background, and often enough against military class weapons (which your average gangsta gun is not), including fragmentation grenades, explosives, or anti tank guns (yes, there are enough people in the world who would use them in closed rooms) and against actual military units (average gangster is is not comparable to average trained solder). They fight where no SWAT team would ever do service, except in a total war, maybe.

And please don't say something like "not trained to hesitate". They actually are, both in hostage rescuing missions, in pure "elimination" missions, and also in missions to "kidnap" relevant enemies. For just one example of pre-caution, think of reconaissance (at all scales; have a look at your local military advertisement for it's importance).

Military has nothing to do with Rambo movies or Call Of Duty games, you know. And it is not like military is interested in losing good soldiers in close combat for no reason. Especially because training soldiers (and salarying them) is very expensive, and soliders that have field experience are not exchangeable like John Does floppy drive.

That is not to say, civil units have different paradigms, and will probably kill less people in missions. But those missions are not comparable to the missions commited by military units.

The "Combat Missions" TV Show didn't feature Delta Force or the SAS. It was SEALS, SWAT, CIA and US Marines.
And the SWAT team didn't destroy the other teams because there was NO SWAT team.
The teams were made up of a mixture from all the different outfits.

Quote: Original post by Buster2000
The "Combat Missions" TV Show didn't feature Delta Force or the SAS. It was SEALS, SWAT, CIA and US Marines.
And the SWAT team didn't destroy the other teams because there was NO SWAT team.
The teams were made up of a mixture from all the different outfits.

Edward Bugarin and Frank Monestere were both DELTA. I was wrong about SAS though. I've already noted that teams were comingled. I also noted that SWAT had a better kill rate than non-SWAT and a SWAT member won the game.

Delta Force.

They're made for different missions, but if you really want to throw down in an all out fight, then Delta's going to win because that's what they do.

SWAT fights especially criminals, Delta fights especially dangerous anything, terrorists on up. They'll also have more experience with real grenades and real firefights, rare occurrences for SWAT.

The fact that Delta is made up of ultra-hardened combat veterans will also have significant impact.

Quote: Original post by VildNinja

Quote: Original post by tstrimp
They generally stick with CQB weapons which means sub-machine guns and shotguns, both which are lacking in armor penetration.

That's a lie.

I've played rainbow 6 several times, and they DO have assault rifles and other armor penetrating weapons!
They do lack the 50 cal sniper, but I don't think that it would be that useful in infantry combats anyway..

This is ludicrous. You really take your game of Rainbox Six as a source of evidence? And, it does not matter whether that game is based on fact or fiction. Games are not reliable resources of information (and btw, Clancy novels are all fiction, not fact; at least the ones I know, and I've seen enough entities in Rainbow Six which don't exist in reality, like the Rainbow Six group itself).

Both suck.

Simply, simply, simply. It is, completely, indisputable, that only one man could be able to take on both teams, win and have both teams not know he was there.

We need, Mr. 47 himself. He'll sort out this matter in record time and will improve each time until he has done it within a minute.

MR. CODENAME 47

(Oh great, now I'm going to get abuse from almost every other forum member! Maybe I better call in Garrett to get me out without being seen at all.)

Quote: Original post by phresnel

Quote: Original post by VildNinja

Quote: Original post by tstrimp
They generally stick with CQB weapons which means sub-machine guns and shotguns, both which are lacking in armor penetration.

That's a lie.

I've played rainbow 6 several times, and they DO have assault rifles and other armor penetrating weapons!
They do lack the 50 cal sniper, but I don't think that it would be that useful in infantry combats anyway..

This is ludicrous. You really take your game of Rainbox Six as a source of evidence?

That's funny..

Quote: Original post by phresnel

Quote: Original post by VildNinja

Quote: Original post by tstrimp
They generally stick with CQB weapons which means sub-machine guns and shotguns, both which are lacking in armor penetration.

That's a lie.

I've played rainbow 6 several times, and they DO have assault rifles and other armor penetrating weapons!
They do lack the 50 cal sniper, but I don't think that it would be that useful in infantry combats anyway..

This is ludicrous. You really take your game of Rainbox Six as a source of evidence? And, it does not matter whether that game is based on fact or fiction. Games are not reliable resources of information.

I've had several teachers who also said that the internet wasn't a reliable source.
But according to the topic starter:

Quote: Original post by Konfusius
Standard FPS weapons are issued (not including rocket launchers and large explosives).

I would say that a standard FPS game is a better resource than any other media.