Hi there, these questions are for the guru''s out there of c++ and VB. Microsoft has launched c-sharp and i was wondering if it really will enhance programming experience and user experience in terms of efficiency and ease. will it have any major impact on the gaming world? can it replace c++ effectively. Can somebody who knows his stuff answer me please... thanx, mayavi. creativity is the only hope.

This whole discussion was already done a month or two back in this forum I think.

Harry.

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Original post by mayavi

these questions are for the guru''s out there of c++ and VB. Microsoft has launched c-sharp and i was wondering if it really will enhance programming experience and user experience in terms of efficiency and ease. will it have any major impact on the gaming world? can it replace c++ effectively. Can somebody who knows his stuff answer me please...

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Basic summary of C#: It''s MS''s answer to Java. Since Sun took Java away from MS, they''re going to make their own language. It probably will have very little or no impact on the mainstream programming world, most people use precompiled applications, and those that don''t compile them into an executable from the source code.


http://druidgames.cjb.net/

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Original post by HarryW

This whole discussion was already done a month or two back in this forum I think.

Harry.

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I am a new member here harry and that''s why i missed that discussion. I''d look for it but it would be great if you can send me the thread id.

mayavi



creativity is the only hope.

C# is designed so that someone who knows C++ syntax can rapidly develop for .NET. C# was made by the same man who did Object Pascal (Delphi)...he left Borland and went to work for MS. Until the final .NET compilers are released no one knows how fast/slow C# will be.



NaV: The whole .NET structure is different than Java. .NET has no VM, but a dynamic, in-memory compiler (note: compiled code, not byte code) that you can choose not to use at compile time.

Epolevne

I think c# is the same as any precedent Microsoft strategy.

1: A existing product is becoming interesting
2: Copy the existing product that is becoming interesting
3: Add new features to that clone of that existing product.
4: Try to eliminate the existing product by all means possible and even impossible.

5: By repeating step one through 4, for all the existing products, you eliminate all of the existing products.

Even if it does or does not have a VM, it is clear that it is a ripoff of Java with some new Microsoft capabilities. They have done it in the past, and they are no way going to stop right now.
They have done it for:

DriveSpace: (that utility for doubling the hard drive, I dont remember the name of the original.)

Internet Explorer: By forcing it in the windows OS.

DirectX: when they began, OpenGl was far superior...

Excel and Word: Lotus and WordPerfect.

Foxpro: DBase

And now with the .net initiative...

SirCyr:
I don''t see how your view of the MS strategy is any different than any other company in any other field. Just look at cars, hardware, clothing, etc

Welcome to the world of business, the goal is to make money. I wouldn''t want to invest in a company that''s just out to make friends.


Epolevne

So if I understand your point of view it must mean:

since everybody does it, then it must be because its right. So Im justified to act this way.

Of course this is a business, but it doesnt mean they can do whatever they want. I refuse a business model that does everything to keep the investors happy. And this is why I boycott them the way I can. And this is why I don''t go to McDonald, dont buy Hasbro toys...and I dont encourage Microsoft.

Im not asking you to agree... And Im not an extremist, just somebody who thinks his choice have an impact. :o)

C# is based on the URT. This allows all .NET programs to communicate with each other. For businesses, this is great, your old Cobol.Net programs can talk to your C#.NET programs and be displayed through your VB.NET programs, allowing businesses to crank out internal apps quickly. They need this.

It''s only a reaction to Sun/Java in that anytime *anybody* does a better Java than Sun, Sun sues them. The URT and .NET platform are going through ECMA, Microsoft is sharing this with the world -- you didn''t think Microsoft was producing Cobol.NET, did you?

Java''s dying fast. C++ will not be replaced, it''s low ratio of source to ASM is as good as it gets and still support advanced programming concepts and manage the complexity of today''s large apps. Any app that needs speed and/or low-level control, will still need C++.

They may make C# fast, but I don''t think any lang will do better than C++ and not even C++ can do better than ASM.

So how can microsoft beat their competitors again and again by offering simliar products that is already on the market?

Well the answer to this question is something most haxx0rs even doesn''t want to think of... but fact is microsoft often wins because their products are superior. There. Now i said it, flame me all you want.

Some examples:
1. netscape - explorer competition. You can argue that explorer was forced on to people by various means but fact remains: netscape sucks. it has always sucked and nowadays it sucks more than anything else has ever sucked before.

2. word - wordperfect & lotus 1-2-3 - excel. Lotus and wordperfect were actually better than word & excel for a while but then they became far superior and suddenly both wordperfect and lotus (you guessed it) sucked.

3. java - c-sharp. Dont know the outcome of this one yet but in my opinion some parts of java suck. did you know that java has some limitations that makes certain apps difficult to transfer between platforms?

4. opengl - directx. If the opengl group doesn''t do anything about their library it will soon suck pretty hard. directx is already superior to opengl in some areas. if im not mistaken reference opengl does not have bump mapping (though nvidia has made some special thingy that makes it possible on their cards).

im no microsoft fan but fact remains: windows is currently the os with best applications, best interfaces etc.