I would like to be able to use settings from another installed program for use in a game. For example during installation the game could search the computer for installed instant messaging programs. Then if found read the setting files from those programs to pull information such as what sound they are using for when someone from their buddy list logs on, then use that same sound file in the game for when one of their in game buddies log on in the game. I realize the first there would have to be any extensive disclaimer informing the user that the installer will do this, possible problems with antivirus software seeing the installer as a worm and blocking it, and I would possibly have to leave it as an option to turn this feature off. However what kind of legal situation would this leave me in with the creators of the instant messaging software? I have seen president with things like this before such as firefox reading IE’s favorites and importing them for you, but even so this leaves my spider senses tingling and they are saying that I am risking legal reproductions with this idea. Does this type f thing fall under the DMCA? If anyone here has any experience with this kind of feature and the legalities of it I would appreciate any input you are willing to give me.

I really don't think it's such a big deal. Yes, you should definitely have it optional in the installer ('Do you want to import settings from your IM programs?'), but other than that, there shouldn't be any problems.

All you're doing is checking whether files exist and reading settings from a text-based config file. I seriously doubt that an installer reading from program files will trigger anti-virus software, and you aren't evading any sort of copy protection, so the DMCA shouldn't be a problem.

I think that even if the makers of the IM program learned about it and tried to stop you, they wouldn't have the legal right to do so. Plus, if worst came to worst, you could just remove the feature.

Of course, I'm not a lawyer, YMMV, etc.

I`m not a lawyer and you should really talk to a lawyer but like Nagromo I can`t see any problems. All you are doing is reading a file and if it is part of the set-up which the user confirms "would you like to...." then users should be happy. Lots of programs import settings from other programs and I think most people like not having to re-enter stuff like that. I know I do.

Most IM providers have made an SDK available. They should be freely available and should simplify your life quite a bit. Some, however, have put restrictions on how you integrate their IM functionality into other applications; I remember that Adobe's AOL ICQ and AIM have restrictions for commercial purposes.

-cb

If we're talking about a system sound, I also don't think it's a problem. If you want to play a sound that was distributed with the IM application, you are likely going to be in breach of copyright.

Standard disclaimers apply, IANALADNWTBO :)

Quote: Original post by lightbringer
If we're talking about a system sound, I also don't think it's a problem. If you want to play a sound that was distributed with the IM application, you are likely going to be in breach of copyright.

Standard disclaimers apply, IANALADNWTBO :)

Yeah that’s what I was thinking too. If I look up their sound files and the sound that is being used happens to be one installed by another piece of software (not a system sound) I would be using a sound that was created and copyrighted by someone else in my game. However it is not being distributed with my game, I would only be using assets that are already on the end users computer, so the only people who get that sound will be the people who already have the IM software installed.

This is where I find it sticky; it’s not quite the same as importing a buddy list. Buddy lists are made by the end user while using the software I would be using config files and assets that other software provided.

Quote: Original post by lightbringer
If you want to play a sound that was distributed with the IM application, you are likely going to be in breach of copyright.

Nope.

Copyright would more correctly be called "the distribution of copies right", since it only affects stuff that you give other people access to. With the exception of a the few nasty points in the DMCA, this is basically the rule: Copyright does not affect your right to acquire stuff. Copyright does not affect your right to use things you have acquired. Copyright does not affect your right to make derivative works of things. Copyright DOES affect your ability to DISTRIBUTE or display or perform those things.

The (fairly stupid) exception is that you are limited from making multiple copies of your own digital stuff for personal use, and limited in the number of backup copies of software.

If you aren't distributing the sound files but instead point at their existing files (at the user's request) then you are just fine.

If you bundled the sound files with your application and allowed people to download it, it would be a clear violation of copyright.

Quote: Original post by frob
Copyright DOES affect your ability to DISTRIBUTE or display or perform those things.

Wait, wait. Isn't this essentially what I claimed above? Maybe I'm misunderstanding.

Using third party resources without distributing them has been a gray area for a while. There are a couple of game clones out there that do it extensively, but I'm not aware of this being upheld as legal in court yet.

Putting aside the question of copyright for a minute, there will be other issues involved. Those sound files usually come with an EULA attached - which could forbid this kind of usage by limiting the user's rights. For instance, the following paragraph is from MSN Messenger's license.rtf file:

Quote: If there is no license presented to you, then we grant you the right to use the software only for the authorized use of the service on that number of computers stated in your service offer. We reserve all other rights to the software.

So if those resources are considered part of the software, a third party program using them may not necessarily be in violation of said license - but wouldn't it cause the user of the software to violate said license?

On a side note, I may well be overly biased here, because I am slightly prejudiced against this kind of usage of resources - someone put in effort in to create them, possibly for their application only, and they do not benefit from a third party's creative usage of said resources.

Quote:

Quote: Original post by frob
Copyright DOES affect your ability to DISTRIBUTE or display or perform those things.

Wait, wait. Isn't this essentially what I claimed above? Maybe I'm misunderstanding.

By perform and display, I mean public display and public performance of works. For example, you cannot legally perform your new DVD on the Giant JumboTron Screen in front of millions of spectators unless you pay the appropriate royalties. You cannot perform a series of plays based on Webber's Evita at your college without proper royalties.

However, you can play your DVD for yourself, and you can act out Evita as often as you like behind closed doors. Copyright covers distribution, public display and public performance.

A media player can play a given media file without fear, since the human who gave it to the media player is responsible for the legality. Much like a Xerox machine can make copies without Xerox being in trouble for copyright infringement.

Quote: Putting aside the question of copyright for a minute, there will be other issues involved. Those sound files usually come with an EULA attached - which could forbid this kind of usage by limiting the user's rights. For instance, the following paragraph is from MSN Messenger's license.rtf file:

Quote: If there is no license presented to you, then we grant you the right to use the software only for the authorized use of the service on that number of computers stated in your service offer. We reserve all other rights to the software.

So if those resources are considered part of the software, a third party program using them may not necessarily be in violation of said license - but wouldn't it cause the user of the software to violate said license?

I'm not sure where that came from. :-) That seems to say to me that if you don't have an existing license to MSN Messenger, then they are granting you permission to use it.

Quote: On a side note, I may well be overly biased here, because I am slightly prejudiced against this kind of usage of resources - someone put in effort in to create them, possibly for their application only, and they do not benefit from a third party's creative usage of said resources.

That is the intention of copyrights, to protect the creator of resources and ensure they get proper compensation for their work.

By allowing the user to copy settings from another application, you are not taking any benefits away from the creator of the original sounds.

Assuming that the user can customize the sounds with any arbitrary sound file, you are saving them the effort of pointing the files the same way for themselves. As mentioned by others, it is just like a web browser importing your existing links, XMMS importing Windows Media Player's playlists, or a new email client importing your address book. You are not usurping control or denying benefits from the original creator, you are instead reducing the time it takes for the human to manually perform the action.

Okay, you've more or less convinced me =) The point about public display is also much clearer now, somehow I didn't pick up on it before. Still won't hurt to read all appropriate licenses and maybe consult a lawyer though.