Can a gamedeveloping company actually copyright a network protocol? Because it seems that most developers either think they already have or are automatically entitled to such a thing on/in relation to their proprietary networking protocol just because they made it. I get the point of EULAs and such, but let's assume that I, for instance, was going to make an emulator for World of Warcraft, The Sims Online or, for that matter, City of Heroes, and that I never played any of these games but had gotten protocol information off the internet. That would mean that I had never agreed to any EULA. Could the producers of said games (for the purpose of this example) still sue me for using their protocol even if I used all of my own code?

Quote: Original post by Afr0m@n
Can a gamedeveloping company actually copyright a network protocol?

You need to learn the difference between the various types of IP protection: copyright, trademark, patent. For starters: http://www.sloperama.com/advice/lesson39.htm

Copyright is not the pertinent form here. You're thinking of patenting.

And as far as patents go its impossible to get a valid patent for software, algoritms, business methods, etc in most European countries. (i don't know for sure about norway though).

Server emulators are mostly legal, there is however issues with using the official client on unofficial servers (generally this violates the EULA), Thus you might get in trouble by allowing users of the official client to connect to your server, There is also the issue of copy-protection. If your server allows illegal copies of the game clients to play you might violate the DMCA (also US specific so it should be safe outside the US aslong as you prevent US users from using the service).

Quote: Original post by SimonForsman
And as far as patents go its impossible to get a valid patent for software, algoritms, business methods, etc in most European countries. (i don't know for sure about norway though).

It is true you cannot patent software directly.

However, you can patent processes which are independent of computers that are protected when that particular implementation of the process is in software.

Quote: Original post by frob

Quote: Original post by SimonForsman
And as far as patents go its impossible to get a valid patent for software, algoritms, business methods, etc in most European countries. (i don't know for sure about norway though).

It is true you cannot patent software directly.

However, you can patent processes which are independent of computers that are protected when that particular implementation of the process is in software.

in general no, processes are not patentable in europe if they are mathematical in nature (which is a requirement for them to be implemented in software).

Virtually all patents covering algoritms that are valid in the US (and Japan) (such as those for LZW compression, mp3 encoding, etc) are invalid here. (Some have been incorrectly granted by the EPO though but those can't really be enforced)

In general one could say that any algoritm that could be performed by a human using pen and paper would be impossible to get a valid patent for here.

There was a proposition recently that would have made all those patents valid, however it got rejected and thus the majority of all software related patents in europe are still invalid and would thus be revoked if challenged.

Norway isn't a member of the European union though and even member nations can ignore the EPO. (Thus eventhough the EPO grants patents on algoritms and business methods regulary both European Patent Law and National laws invalidate those patents)

While it is true that an invention that contains software can be patented it is impossible for pure software to infringe on a patent.

[Edited by - SimonForsman on March 12, 2007 6:47:51 PM]

Huh.

I was under the impression that the European Patent Office appeals board decisions allowed certain patents when implemented in software, if they are otherwise of valid technical character.

They do not allow patents on software, nor do they allow patents on certain classes of algorithms or business practices. But they DO allow patents on processes that meet other technical requirements, even if they are implemented on a computer.

Just last year we get this case with a landmark explicit definition:
EPO appeals ruled that certain software 'clipboard' functionality is patentable. Notably: "Even though a method, in particular a method of operating a computer, may be put into practice with the help of a computer program, a claim relating to such a method does not claim a computer program in the category of a computer program." and "A computer-readable medium is a technical product and, thus, has technical character."

EPO appeals ruled that a patent on an auction process (which was used for online auctions) is patentable.

EPO appeals ruled that in-game HUD display routine is patentable.

EPO appeals ruled that software-enhanced text display is patentable.

There are many more, but the EPO board of appeals has consistently laid out that methods and processes that have a technical character are patentable, even if a particular implementation happens to be on a computer.

Thanks for the info guys! :)

Yes, SimonForsman is right, Norway is not a member of the European Union, and I hope to everything that is holy in this world and the next that we won't ever be. I guess I'm going to have to consult specific Norwegian laws about this, but I am hoping, as Simon pointed out, that if I disallow American users as well as users of the original client to access my server, noone can sue me for using their protocol in Norway. :)

Quote: Original post by Afr0m@n
Yes, SimonForsman is right, Norway is not a member of the European Union, and I hope to everything that is holy in this world and the next that we won't ever be. I guess I'm going to have to consult specific Norwegian laws about this, but I am hoping, as Simon pointed out, that if I disallow American users as well as users of the original client to access my server, noone can sue me for using their protocol in Norway. :)

While norway might not be a card-carrying member of the EU, it's still so tightly connected with the commercial framework through EFTA that it might as well be. All regulatory frameworks adopted for trade and standardization is automatically due for adoption in EFTA countries, but without voting-rights on the matter. Taxation without representation, as the Bostonians might say.

Norwegian rules on reverse-engineering are pretty lax anyways; witness the way Okokrim stuggled in vain to convict DVD-Jon, so you're probably safe. They've been trying to tighten the holes at the frantic urging of the RIAA and cohort (for example the infamous "MP3 law", making it illegal to copy your own CDs onto your private MP3-player) which thankfully have been fended off so far. Never underestimate the stupidity of politicians, nor the resourcefulness of lobbyists, though.

Allan

Quote: Original post by __ODIN__
Never underestimate the stupidity of politicians, nor the resourcefulness of lobbyists, though.

I would have said the greed of politicians and the financial resources of lobbyists.

Remember the quote: There are two things you need for success in politics. Money... and I can't think of the other. ~ Senator Mark Hannah, 1903.