quote: Original post by kseh

I have never seen haggling done well. Or maybe it''s just something I''ve always sucked at. I never really know how high to start the bidding and when I bid too high the merchant gets ticked and either won''t talk to me or won''t budge on a rediculously low price. In the end I feel like the rewards of haggling are just too low or I never know if I really got a good deal or not. Not that haggling is necissarilly a bad element to add to a game, it''s just one persons experiences.

Stealing an idea from Starflight 2, do you think it would help if you had some indication of a commodity''s average trade value?

For instance, if Stercasium Ore is offered at 150 c/t, and you see that that''s 70% below the average trade price, then might be inclined to buy. But if 150 credits/ton is 200% of the average price, then no way!

Would that work? In Starflight 2, you get the price of each good, and a percentage next to it. You want to buy for below 100%, and sell for above 100%



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Just waiting for the mothership...

quote: Original post by DungeonMaster

I prefer limited broadcasting, because else there is no point in exploring... Perhaps the only thing that can travel faster than light are ships, so specific drone ships carry the information as fast as they can. This way the the time distortion can be the
communication limitation.

I like this. It makes the sector bigger.

quote:
If you use a story network, each node would represent events, and each link would represent the actors relationship depending on these events. With a trigger system, you could generate informations depending on your story, or even intertwined with the story... that is if you go for non linear

Hmmm... okay, have to look at this more. I still have a lot of work to do to build in AI actions and how they work, and have only started at the top most level (empires).



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Just waiting for the mothership...

quote: Original post by morfe

Give the traders personalities.

Interesting! This would flesh out trading nicely. Personalities could determine what traders deal in, and how they trade. That way you could have a "Quark" like character who haggles a lot, and can get you access to certain... non-legal items.

Going to have to weight this one. If I end up with 200 different trading bases, characters won''t work. But for a small sector, or one not very explored, this might be nice.

Or this could be a bonus, sort of like "hero characters" you find at certain bases.



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Just waiting for the mothership...

quote:
Wavinator:

Stealing an idea from Starflight 2, do you think it would help if you had some indication of a commodity''s average trade value?

For instance, if Stercasium Ore is offered at 150 c/t, and you see that that''s 70% below the average trade price, then might be inclined to buy. But if 150 credits/ton is 200% of the average price, then no way!

Would that work? In Starflight 2, you get the price of each good, and a percentage next to it. You want to buy for below 100%, and sell for above 100%

I don''t know. The question I guess I''d ask is, is it really worth it to get double what something''s worth? It''d probably depend on the entire economy or something. Haggling has just always been something that if I can turn it off, then I do. Even if I could make more money on half the deals in the game. When the price is so low in the first place, 2 c/t isn''t worth the mouse clicks compared to 1 c/t. And when the price is high, it''s not so much how much you sell it for, it''s how much you bought it for in the first place. I wouldn''t try to trade between two ports if I wasn''t guarenteed a 400% profit for example and I''d be trying to find the 1000% ones most often. When the factor is already that high, haggling just seems to get in the way.

Of course, if it was between me and a Spemin Captain trying to buy the last Flat Device from a starport, I''d want the opertunity to try and out bid him. Though, I wouldn''t want to leave feeling that it was all about making me spend more money.

Just one opinion.

Doh! Just posted suggestions from Starflight 2 in the previous thread. oh well. Thats a pretty old game. How many people have actually played it? I think it was one of the best games ever...



Jack

quote: Original post by kseh

I don''t know. The question I guess I''d ask is, is it really worth it to get double what something''s worth? It''d probably depend on the entire economy or something. Haggling has just always been something that if I can turn it off, then I do. Even if I could make more money on half the deals in the game. When the price is so low in the first place, 2 c/t isn''t worth the mouse clicks compared to 1 c/t. And when the price is high, it''s not so much how much you sell it for, it''s how much you bought it for in the first place. I wouldn''t try to trade between two ports if I wasn''t guarenteed a 400% profit for example and I''d be trying to find the 1000% ones most often. When the factor is already that high, haggling just seems to get in the way.

Sorry to keep bugging you about this (but in the interest of attracting more players)...

In SF2 the traders offer their price. You can immediately accept it, thus no bargaining. Would this work for you, or would you rather a seperate checkbox that simply says "No Bargaining" as part of the Game Options screen.

I''m already going to include, btw, a way of seeing the potential profit you''d make on any transaction before you make it. So if the Tandu are offering something to buy something you have at 122% market price, when you mouse over the item you''ll see (400% profit = 120,000 credits, or whatever)

Again, just curious.

quote:
Of course, if it was between me and a Spemin Captain trying to buy the last Flat Device from a starport, I''d want the opertunity to try and out bid him. Though, I wouldn''t want to leave feeling that it was all about making me spend more money.

Yeah, I''m going to have to find some way of including some type of bidding, just because competitive bidding is very cool... Still thinking...

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Just waiting for the mothership...

A merchant''s desire to haggle should be based on basic supply/demand. If he is the only provider of a certain commodity at a particular planet or station and its something that is regularly purchased, i.e. fuel, then he should be less willing to haggle and should also periodically adjust his base price up.

Are computer controlled merchants responsible for purchasing their own stock of items or do they create them as they need them?

Oh, and as to providing the average price of an item during trade negotiation, it would be more realistic to give a "known" average price, that is the average of the most recent prices that the player is aware of. Giving a world-wide average seems to take the value out of information that the player has accumulated about where the best trading locations are and such.

quote: Original post by Hobbes
A merchant''s desire to haggle should be based on basic supply/demand. If he is the only provider of a certain commodity at a particular planet or station and its something that is regularly purchased, i.e. fuel, then he should be less willing to haggle and should also periodically adjust his base price up.

This seems right. Monopolists should make you pay through the nose, which would encourage you to either find an alternate source, or maybe deal in something else. (Although there should be some reason to this... traders often pass markups to their customers, rather than take all the pain themselves)

quote:
Are computer controlled merchants responsible for purchasing their own stock of items or do they create them as they need them?

I''m not sure about this yet. There''s definitely a production mechanic to allow the player to interfere with production. But I hadn''t considered actually having the trade bases purchase stock. Rather they have an average wealth and need for items based on the planet / system they''re in.

quote:
Oh, and as to providing the average price of an item during trade negotiation, it would be more realistic to give a "known" average price, that is the average of the most recent prices that the player is aware of. Giving a world-wide average seems to take the value out of information that the player has accumulated about where the best trading locations are and such.

Hmmmm... Good point, and not too hard to do. But it would make it harder to know if you''re doing well at the start (before you''ve bought maps and explored and such). The solution to this would probably be to make it easier to acquire information earlier...

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Just waiting for the mothership...

Say you suck at/despise haggling. Why not be able to hire a crew member, say a Negotiator, to represent you and get the best possible price for you?

That way, if you like haggling you can, and if you don''t, you can get past it but not suffer financially because of it.

quote: Original post by morfe

Say you suck at/despise haggling. Why not be able to hire a crew member, say a Negotiator, to represent you and get the best possible price for you?

That way, if you like haggling you can, and if you don''t, you can get past it but not suffer financially because of it.

Hey, another type of hero character!

How much would you recommend this guy do? Would you just buy at fixed prices, or would you go as far as him handling all of trade? If you have a Negotiator, it kind of implies that he knows a lot about trade. Would he know about trade locations, and secrets, and such???



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Just waiting for the mothership...