What are your thoughts on gaining territory in a base by locking doors and controlling space given enemies who continuously respawn? The respawning would basically be stopped by either firepower or sectioning off parts of the base. You could lock a door, or hold ground with NPCs and automated weapons (turrets, mechs, etc.). As you were trying to control space, you'd have to get past doors and avoid things like arcing electricity or hazardous waste. You'd have tools to navigate and repair / hack the environment, specialist NPCs to post at positions, and doors of varying strength. The doors could be battered down, welded shut, or rigged with traps, but if you did that, it might backfire as you might not be able to get out yourself before being overwhelmed by the horde. Also, if you forgot and left a door open or monsters beat it down, they could overrun points, cutting you off from supplies or killing personnel made vulnerable by being in VR. Thoughts?

Sound good, in fact if done well it could be great. I'm assuming this is from an RPG, action/adventure or tactical squad perspective, as this kind of thing is a staple in the RTS and base-building (Dungeon Keeper et al.) genre.

Also, I'm assuming the objective is something other than 'kill all the monsters', so that survival is more important. If that's the case, this could be done quite well. I don't think I've seen this gameplay meme included in an RPG setting. It has been done in a tactical squad setting before; the examples that spring to mind are 'survive for X minutes while the extraction team comes to rescue you'. It is also done in the horror survival games quite well too (survive the zombie horde for X minutes). Resident Evil 4 does this very well.

I'd make it a bit more freeform than what most games do though. Give the player a few escape points to handle. If the player closes off all escape points, then there'd be high defense, but nowhere to run. If there's one escape point then that could be used as a breach in the defences.

Edit: just a thought, what exactly is the technical term for the base-building genre of games? Examples of these are: Sim City, RollerCoaster Tycoon, Tropico, Dungeon Keeper, Theme Park/Hospital. I'm currently planning on making one so I'd like to know what to call them.

[Edited by - Trapper Zoid on July 14, 2005 9:39:16 PM]

I've seen this done in a few custom Starcraft Maps, from a FPS perpsective it could be pretty cool. Limited ammunition and supplies for baracades, mix in some interesting player interaction (like traitors, or those who think they can make it on their own) and you'd have some fun memorable experiences. ;D

::Heavily editted for cogency::

It's good to be able to adjust the environment to your tactical advantage, but it's lousy to be flailing around with world-editting tools. I don't want to weld a door, seal an airlock and open a Halon pipe behind me only to learn that that's the only way out. A dynamic entry probably won't last more than a few minutes, so you need to know where you're going and what you're doing before you go there and do it.

I recommend a good planning phase system. Let players steal blueprints, or use an "inside man" to get a layout of their objectives. Let them run a few easy missions to score access codes or intelligence on enemy armament before going into such a situation. Then let them set up quick plans to be executed in-game. Your heavy gunner knows that when you get to a certain hallway, he might be required to put up a barricade and hold it until you come pick him up on the way out.

When you get there, if you've been detected, you can just highlight that guy and click the "You know what to do" button instead of wasting priceless seconds issuing orders or (God help us!) doing it all yourself. When you get to within a hundred yards of your extraction point, and the dropship is hovering just outside that open window, you could slap the "Engage according to operational parameters!" key and let your team load up and dust off on their own. I loved the "Full Watch" mode in Rainbow Six, although it was rigid and crappy, because it made my team seem like a group of highly trained tactical experts, rather than a collection of hollow polygons.

For reference, Star Wars: Republic Commando does some neat stuff with hot spots (I'm sure one of your other threads addressed this). Also, Full Spectrum Warrior has a few times when you have to use your fire teams to hold a position while a specialist does something, well, special, like planting a bomb on a tank's treads or moving into position for some sharpshooting.

[Edited by - Iron Chef Carnage on July 16, 2005 10:43:03 AM]

Quote:

Original post by Wavinator Thoughts?

You've been watching Aliens, haven't you? [grin]

At least, that's certainly what your post makes me think of. The part where they set up barricades, weld doors shut, and set up the sentry guns to hold back the endless stream of xenomorphs.

Another similar thing is perhaps the old GW game, Space Hulk, although it's hardly surprising it's similar because it draws heavily on Aliens in the first place.

Anyway, I would really like to see something like this as a game in it's own right. It has enormous amounts of potential. Maps would be almost puzzle like in nature, as you'd have to figure out the optimum way to cover it with your extremely limited resources. The maps themselves could be highly interactive, giving the player a huge range of options for dealing with the alien hordes, e.g

Fire Suppression systems: triggered by large fires, spoils visibility, possibly toxic to aliens and/or marines.

Intruder Defence systems: can be configured by the player if he reaches a special security room(s). Activates auto sentries all over the map. For extra pain, these might be active right at the start, only set hostile to everything - must be reconfigured to let your marines past.

Power systems: All other systems require power - therefore in order for them to work, they must be connected to a working power source. Turning on the power source may not be enough - there may be damage to the cabling which also needs repair.

Airlocks: Can be used to blast aliens out into space. Alternatively, you can blast the airlock itself, triggering a series of emergency doors to slam down and rendering a section of the map uninhabitable.

Remote Drones: Reach a control room and you can take control of a remote controlled drone somewhere on the map (not necessarily starting in the control room). There are various types of drone: Salvage drones (can recover dead/wounded people, as well as other equipment) Modem Drones (enable access to a computer in a different room) Repair Drones (can repair damaged systems and cabling) and of course, Combat drones (shoot stuff). Drones are not attacked by intruder defence systems, and can travel in any environment, regardless of gas or vaccuum. However, aliens may still attack them.

1. Drones.

Simple Autonomous Robots.
They can be given simple orders, yet they have neither fine moter skills, nor amazing intelect, so sometimes they make the wrong decisions. (mainly since they see in IR only).

There pretty much a solid orb, with a camera on one end. (and small sensors at 30 degree intervals, but it sees less from those).

Its guns are next to its camera. (Small mazers, can damage some electrical equipment, cause damage if close enough, but causes pain, which causes units to stop responding).

Some are more hevily armed (with lazers, which can cause large damage, and can kill if it hits the right spot, some with small missles).

2. bulkheads.

If you can seal these, it requires heavey explosives to open it.

3. Smog granade

These cause a line of fog to pour into a room, filling it up from the bottom.
If anything explodes in the room, or anything living is there, the fog boils off smoke. (so, if you throw a smog grenade, wait for it to fill up the room, then throw a normal grenade, the whole room gets filled with smoke).

4. Magnetically sealed doors

These are doors that are sealed, by magnets, and require power in order for you to unlock them. (there usually acess control,l, based).

5. Data grid

If you have scouts (or the intruder defence grid, or anhy sort of electronic sensor), and you have your guns (your turrets, your perimeter defence grids, ect.), they need to communicate targetting resolutions and locks.

So, if the data grid is down, the guns are shooting blind. (which is bad)

6. Door putty

This is basically very fine magnets, with iron filings, suspended in oil.

You pour it into the crevise, and it magnetically fuses the door shut. (Requires extream heat, or extream force to open).

7. Wired explosives
In some sections, there are mines, which are not armed by themselves, but are armed by the computers.

When you walk passed something that is mined, it explodes, killing you.

Others have a backup, ir detonator, so watch out.

8. Hazard rooms -
Some rooms are irradiated by microwaves (usually secure rooms, with nothing but bare walls, and two doors, the inner one is magnetically sealed).

You need to turn off the power in order to walk in without dying.

From,
Nice coder

I think an interesting reversed tactical aspect of Magnetic doors is that you could need power to lock them. Creates quite the problem for the player, you can unlock all the magnetic doors if you take the power down, but then the internal defenses go offline to. So if the player wants a quick exit or free access, he'll make it just as easy on his enemies as himself to get around.

A fire could also automatically activate fire suppression protocal, which locks all the magnetic doors leading into the area to prevent the spread of the fire (or to contain any biological breach or whathaveyou).

Quote:

Original post by Trapper Zoid I'd make it a bit more freeform than what most games do though. Give the player a few escape points to handle. If the player closes off all escape points, then there'd be high defense, but nowhere to run. If there's one escape point then that could be used as a breach in the defences.

I'm seeing a situation where you could get locked in and die from lack of supplies. (NPCs and your character have health that declines without food, and morale that drops, possibly causing arguing and infighting depending on how cohesive the team is.)

Do you think players should be allowed to get into a situation like this, or should the game through map design or enemy AI design make this impossible?

Quote:

Edit: just a thought, what exactly is the technical term for the base-building genre of games? Examples of these are: Sim City, RollerCoaster Tycoon, Tropico, Dungeon Keeper, Theme Park/Hospital. I'm currently planning on making one so I'd like to know what to call them.

Sure, these are called... uh... base-building games? [lol]

Quote:

Original post by Iron Chef Carnage I recommend a good planning phase system. Let players steal blueprints, or use an "inside man" to get a layout of their objectives. Let them run a few easy missions to score access codes or intelligence on enemy armament before going into such a situation. Then let them set up quick plans to be executed in-game. Your heavy gunner knows that when you get to a certain hallway, he might be required to put up a barricade and hold it until you come pick him up on the way out.

So do you think the fun comes from successful planning and then execution, rather than surprise encounters? A lot of times, we roam the dungeons in games not knowing what we'll come up against. If you can scout a level, you can remove surprises, which actually might be fine if the game goal heavily emphasizes survival.

I like the idea of somehow doing something to scout the level, such as stealing or finding plans (maybe, for instance, if a dungeon is made up of an old subway system, you can locate the ruins of a city's planning office and get them, or something...)

So maybe you should be able to set up these things on the map:

* Rally Points - Everybody goes here when you signal

* Choke Points - Everyone concentrates fire on an enemy when it enters this zone

* Specialist Points - The specialist who can do something automatically does it as soon as possible at this point (fix a machine, snipe, etc.)

We're probably on average not all great planners, so you should be able to pause the game and replan on the fly. Otherwise, people are going to be dealing with plans that no longer apply.

Quote:

When you get to within a hundred yards of your extraction point, and the dropship is hovering just outside that open window, you could slap the "Engage according to operational parameters!" key and let your team load up and dust off on their own.

Should it be automatic, or a some comms command? For instance, you'd think certain things should be automatic, such as getting wounded onboard or taking up a sniping position and picking off guys coming over a bridge. But if you assume, the player could be doing something else. One of the only ways I can think to communicate intent is via modes.

Maybe you have these modes: On Mission (everybody does what you've preplanned); Retreat (everybody runs like hell along some waypoint path you've planned); Stealth (people take actions as long as they don't give away position)

btw, do you think including this dampens the RPG aspect?

Quote:

Original post by Gyrthok I've seen this done in a few custom Starcraft Maps, from a FPS perpsective it could be pretty cool. Limited ammunition and supplies for baracades, mix in some interesting player interaction (like traitors, or those who think they can make it on their own) and you'd have some fun memorable experiences. ;D

Wow, yeah, I think if there's some sort of team interaction metagame with loyalty and personality clashes this could be immersive.

The challenge for me always comes in whether to play up the tactical stuff or the personal interaction stuff. I've never seen an RPG with deep tactical gameplay in the FPS / 3rd person (usually it's iso & you control everybody).