I'm currently makng prepartions to create my own small RPG demo. I originally planned to make the game totally 2D (Since I figure my pixel art skills are probably up to the task, but I guess you can see for yourself here: http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=304247&PageSize=25&WhichPage=2).. Anyways I gave the game some thought and decided I would prefer to take the whole "2D characters, 3D environments" approach as it would give me some good practise in my 3D programming using DirectX cuz i'm a little rusty (I'm doing some 3D at the moment but its wid Java3D for my university final yr project.. *dont ask*) NEways I was just curious as to if anyone here has done any spritework for 3D games? If the environments are 3D then what size/resolution should I be looking at for the sprites themselves as it would be preferred to try and keep a consistently reasonable level of detail in the graphics overall.. Also are there any issues with creating 2D sprites for 3D that I should be making a note of for when I start writing the game engine? I wasn't sure where the best place to post these questions would be but I thought the more technically minded artists should hopefully be able to shed some light on these issues for me.. Thankyou for your time.. - (Ola)Dotun Rominiyi -

Hmm.. one of the few examples i've seen of good 2D sprites with 3D environments would have to be Ragnarok Online, if you haven't seen it yet it might be a good place to check out. I'd say sprites that are 32x64 upto 64x64(for different possitions/actions) in 800x600 resolution would work well (not counting zooming in/out), thats how Ragnarok online appears to have done it anyway.

It depends on how you want your game to look. If you want it to have the old "32 bit" look, you can make your sprites smaller, then scale them up to what ever size you need, and still get away with them looking a bit blocky. If you want them to look more realistic, they need to be bigger. You can still scale them up a bit, just make sure to use a filter that blurs them.

Also, I don't know what libraries you are using, but for compatibilities sake, stick to images where the dimentions are powers of two. (32,64,128, etc)

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Original post by methinks It depends on how you want your game to look. If you want it to have the old "32 bit" look, you can make your sprites smaller, then scale them up to what ever size you need, and still get away with them looking a bit blocky. If you want them to look more realistic, they need to be bigger. You can still scale them up a bit, just make sure to use a filter that blurs them. Also, I don't know what libraries you are using, but for compatibilities sake, stick to images where the dimentions are powers of two. (32,64,128, etc)

Thanx for the info about the resolutions being powers of 2, and i'll definately take a look at ragnarok online a see what its like..

I'll probably be using DirectX since its the only 3D API i'm experienced with (well.. except for Java3D which.. well.. nuff said about that one really..)

Erm.. would it be beneficial to do eight-directional sprites since a 3D engine will allow camera rotation?

I would like to try and get away with doing 4-derections (cuz its quicker for the spriting) but if it looks naff then i might not have a choice.. Does anyone kno of any games like this that use 4-directions? just so u can tell me how good/bad it is or if it even makes much difference at all..

Also whats a good technique for creating the textures for the 3D environs? As it would be beneficial to maintain a similar style on the characters and backdrops (artistically) so I wanna give them a kinda cartoony (2D but obviously not 2D)feel..?

If you are going to use these sprites in a 3d environment, why would you have their animations limited to four directions, unless you are short on time?

EDIT: put 2d environment instead of 3d, typo

[Edited by - xCronus on March 30, 2005 11:06:47 PM]

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Original post by xCronus If you are going to use these sprites in a 2d environment, why would you have their animations limited to four directions, unless you are short on time?

By this I assume you mean a 3D environment?

Well, since I'm gonna be working on this project completely by myself, and since I know that getting each individual sprite to the level of quality i'm looking to achieve will take a good proportion of time, I'm just trying to be realistic and set constraints which will allow me to finish the task of building a complete game demo and then maybe leave room for expansion..

I'm aiming to get the most of it done during the summer so that when I return to uni in september it should have a significant amount already completed..

on a game im working on im using prerenderd 3d sprites, this way i can easly get as many views as i want(8 views since its a tile based tactics game) and making a hi-poly modles is a lot easyer than modeling and skinning a lo-poly one,

how good it will look will depend on your game but i dont think 4 or even a 8 direction will lokk good for a 3D panaround

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Original post by Kaze on a game im working on im using prerenderd 3d sprites, this way i can easly get as many views as i want(8 views since its a tile based tactics game) and making a hi-poly modles is a lot easyer than modeling and skinning a lo-poly one, how good it will look will depend on your game but i dont think 4 or even a 8 direction will lokk good for a 3D panaround

Are you serious?

Then please can I ask how many directions do you suggest?

I've seen many 3D games which use 2D sprites with 8 directions and it seems to be quite sufficient a number to keep things look slick and smooth when the camera is rotating.. Maybe you'd like to show me your reasoning as to why you don't feel eight directions is good enough? (I'm not trying to mock or scold your statement so please don't take it that way, I'm merely interested to find out why you feel this way?)

Sorry that anonymous poster was me by the way (stupid Gamedev.net logged me out for no reason)

Also I've contemplated using 3D rendered characters but the problem is that I can sprite characters and character animations much faster than I can model, texture, rig and animate any 3D models for rendering as my 3D skills are somewhat lacking in comparison to my pixelling skills (which are, should i say.. "well practised").

This just goes towards my arguement of trying to keep things minimal so that the scope of this project is somewhat feasible..

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Original post by ArchangelMorph Also whats a good technique for creating the textures for the 3D environs? As it would be beneficial to maintain a similar style on the characters and backdrops (artistically) so I wanna give them a kinda cartoony (2D but obviously not 2D)feel..?

If you want the textures of the 3d to have the same feel as the 2d sprites, I suggest you use the same technique to create them. That means painting by hand and scanning them, painting them using a program such as photoshop, or even building realistic, high-resolution models, and rendering them as sprites. (You would create a texture with this method by "baking" the high quality render as a texture to the loq polygon objects you will actually use in the game.

A couple of other things to consider:
-Use a simillar pallet:
It doesn't mean that you have to use the exact same colours, but consider the type of colours your using (Earth-tones, pastels, dark cold colours, bright warm colours). If you use a different pallet for your sprites and backgrounds, they won't match up, and something will stand out. Who knows, you might actually want that. (Just a note, be carefull HOW you mix them. A vibrant sprite on a drab background makes the sprite stand out, but a drab sprite on a bright background, and the player won't be able to focus properly on the sprite)

-Detail
If you will be using small sprites, (Such as FF3) each point represents a lot of area. As a result, they are lower detail. To match this, make the background textures with large, simplified details.
Likewise, if you are going for a cartoony look, try the following:
Avoid straight lines, use simple colours (Use a base colour, and one shadow colour) and simplify details. (Instead of drawing each leaf on a tree, draw a few, really large leaves)

-A word on shadows
If you use any shadows in your textures, DO NOT MAKE THEM BLACK!!!
Shadows are never black in real life, and in textures, where you are trying to create a stylized feel, black shadows will flatten and kill the depth and feel of the image. Instead, use a colour opposite to the light source: In real life, shadows are usually blue, in sprite games, dark purple seems to work well.

Just try it out, and see what works.