Okay I just got, like always, another idea for a game. But I am having trouble getting it out of my head in words. Oh well here goes nothing.... Breif Overview I would like it to be a 3d game sword fighting and strategy game. The game is to be set back in medeival times and will use historical nations from around the world. The game will also be focused on Multiplay as in Tribes. One person on each team is selected to be the "General" for that side and picks what nation the team will be, what units will be used, how the army is set up on the feild and controls any AI units from a RTS styled view. He can also set "goals", which appear as markers, for the real players, but they do not have to follow these goals. Then the players can select, from the list provided by the commander, what unit they wish to lead into battle. When both sides are finished wih this they then commence the battle. On the battlefeild the generals each set up there men inside there boundaries, as in medeival: total war. When they are done each player is put in charge of a group of soldiers, around 10-20, which follow him and obey him. He plays in FP but uses keyboard commands to direct his unit. I hope to have horsemen, swordmen, spearmen, archers, horse archers and so on. All nations will have their strehgths and weaknesses based on history and will hopefully have several different unique units per nation. Also there will be alot of strategy involved and use of good tactics. Such as Knights are slow but have a devastating charge, although if they fail to break up the opposing unit in the inital charge they may end up losing, that way no one is really invincible. Men will tire and not be able to run after a while, and Egyptians natrually will not do good in Russia. The land will be determined by the defender and weather slightly affected by the attacker. In FP mode I would like it to be where you can dismount off your horse, get knocked over, block with a sheild and (somehow) have different ways to use your sword. I need lots of ideas so if you got any spit them out. And remember no idea is a bad idea. Here is my possible list of nations: Europe: Britain Germany France Italy Poland-Maybe Spain North Africa to Mid-East: Egypt Turk Byzantine Asia: Russia Mongol China Japan Korea-Maybe Maybe - New World: Aztec Inca Things I am also thinking about are having it so when you first start the game you have a small amount of gold only enough for unit of spearmen or swordmen, which you have to pay to lead. More gold would be given to you for every enemy unit you kill and for every succseful battle. The cost would be higher for say a Royal Knight then a Mounted Man-at-arms unit. And how can i make so the General can give orders to AI, set goals and fight in fp at same time. Maybe he should just stay in rts? So what do you think? Does it sound okay? Sorry for the way it is typed but like i sadi at the top...... -CM EDIT: Come on guys help me out. [Edited by - Corrmick on July 11, 2004 10:42:16 PM]

hi :)

How many players are there totally on the map? how may units total? Suppose you have 8 players on each side and 20 units each player can control, it makes 160 units.

In an RTS, if you just have 160 units fight each other, the battle does not last very long, especially when you have melee units, they might just cancel out pretty quickly.

What pace is the game? How long do you expect the battle to be? Will there be ambushing involved? What makes the teams not sticking together?

Quote:

The cost would be higher for say a Royal Knight then a Mounted Man-at-arms unit.

I think in medieval scale, one cavalry man is comparable to 20-30 footman, due to their mobility and armor. Even against pikemen (say 7), it takes rifles in close range to kill a knight.

Quote:

And how can i make so the General can give orders to AI, set goals and fight in fp at same time.

Have you ever played a knife fight in counter-strike? It is very melee and ends pretty quick. Also consider that in a knife fight you are controlling only you, a group of people is much harder to move after they engaged in battle. What kinds of command can the player make?

you should take a look at the game Savage. it's an FPS/RTS set in a more mythical setting. the general plays the game like starcraft/warcraft. the players play the game like an FPS. there's both melee and ranged weapons.

-me

Look in to BattleZone '98, the original FPS/RTS hybrid. That was a little different, as it was still old-fashioned RTS-style "one human player per army" - but was the prototype for first-person RTS. An excellent game.

One thing I think any FPRTS game with multiple players needs is scalability. Rather than the simple commander/troop relationship, you need seargeants, lieutenants, etc. with power to reward or punish success/failure. A full command heirarchy.

One interesting approach for clan-oriented gameplay would be to have players join in as a "team" and that "team" can be organised any way they like - democratic, despotic, anarchistic, whatever. They're just a squad, and they have their own harvesting gear, etc, and are relatively autonomous. And have one overall "command squad" who levies taxes and builds the high-level artillery and research stuff.

Quote:

Original post by Estok hi :) How many players are there totally on the map? how may units total? Suppose you have 8 players on each side and 20 units each player can control, it makes 160 units. In an RTS, if you just have 160 units fight each other, the battle does not last very long, especially when you have melee units, they might just cancel out pretty quickly. What pace is the game? How long do you expect the battle to be? Will there be ambushing involved? What makes the teams not sticking together? Quote: The cost would be higher for say a Royal Knight then a Mounted Man-at-arms unit. I think in medieval scale, one cavalry man is comparable to 20-30 footman, due to their mobility and armor. Even against pikemen (say 7), it takes rifles in close range to kill a knight. Quote: And how can i make so the General can give orders to AI, set goals and fight in fp at same time. Have you ever played a knife fight in counter-strike? It is very melee and ends pretty quick. Also consider that in a knife fight you are controlling only you, a group of people is much harder to move after they engaged in battle. What kinds of command can the player make?

Thanks this was just the post I was hoping for. Alot of good hard questions. If you have ever played Medieval: Total War, then you know I mean by "units", as in a large block of men. Here is small list of basic units and their numbers:

Knights:
14 + Player = 15

Swordman (Base Swordsman):
29 + Player = 30

SpearMan (Not Pike):
29 + Player = 30

Archer:
14 + Player = 15

So as you can see the forces of the weaker units are more. And I am thinking that the General pays for the units and the people acheive rank to lead them, that way you can't have just a bunch of horsemen charging around killing everyone. But like I said if the Knights do not break up the enemy unit in the initial rush then they have lower chance of success. I think it should make it easier for the other unit's AI to kill the knight's AI, but if the knights break the enemy's formation then the enemy unit has lower moral and is therefor easier to kill.

Ok and as for speed of game, I am thinking maybe 30 min to 1 hour. Ambushes could be made, because you cannot see each other set up and when the game starts each side can only barely see a few of the others units in the distance. So if the General sets some cavalry archers behind some trees way up in the far left of his area, and the game starts, then that cavalry unit could either be directed to rally point or be if it is AI be manually controlled by the general in the RTS view. They could sneak up and charge down and nail the enemy from the rear doing triple damage to that unit. And about sticking together, I don't know but will have to think about that further.

And on commanding your unit I am still sort of grey. But the commands would be similar to basic team combat games commands. Hold Ground, Retreat, Loose formation, tight formation, wedge formation, Fire At Will, Run, Walk. etc. When slashing people it will depend on were you hit, naturaly, how many times, what weapon, and what kind of attack. Hits on basic armoured Militia:

Head:
1 hit

Neck:
1 hit

Arms or legs:
Slash Hits:
2 to 4 hits

Stab hits:
3 or more hits

Chest:
Slash Hits:
3 to 4

Stab Hits:
1 to 2

Ab shots:
3 to 4

When hit you would be slower all over but particularly slow in the area hit. A Light Cavalry Sabre may take multiple hits, but a knights heavy blade or a 2-Handed sword from a Swordman will take very few. I don't know about rifles yet, but I may...
Thanks for the Q's and giving me more to think about Estok.

pxtl: I am going to have to think about that one some more..

Palidine: Different type of game tho.

-CM

Hmm - if a player commands a squad, I think it might be kinda dull if they were homogenous. I'd allow players to customize their teams. Perhaps even just let them levy their own troops from the populace, and you (as king) just give them orders and access to the armoury.

Put yourself in the player's place - the player doesn't want just to be micromanaged, he wants the freedom to implement his orders in his own way. In a medieval scenario this could be done even better, with teams of 2-3 "knights" (players) taking over a small village and converting it into a supply base, levying troops, etc. A hyper-realistic approach could even be done (no "troop factorys", farms are not just buildings but fields you fight through and salt and burn and you must keep your troops fed). The king can rule from the back with maps and rider/messengers and trumpet signals and trebuchet fire-support and maybe magic. And maybe when the big crunch comes he can ride out with his royal team that he has been grooming for the whole game.

GL_GetRTS(); It always works.

hmmm good ideas

Definitely give Natural Selection a look. It's a mod of Half-Life where two teams (marine and alien) each compete for resources in first person mode. The exception is that the marines have a commander who has a top down view of the map, and is the one who places buildings and gives orders-- although the marines don't always obey them. Think of it as a combination between Starcraft and Half-Life.

You could have it where the king gives spcific, verifiable orders (by that I mean specific orders that can be proven to have been carried out, like "folowing this path, move your men into this circle"). Each command could have a time limit, and the player must follow the time limit, or else the team gets penalized. This encourages fair, doable orders. Also, you could make it so your men move faster/are more powerful when on the path of the order (this way, the king can't just sit there and do nothing, because his team needs orders to function better. You could make it the your men get the fastest/strongest when the time limits are smaller, encouring people not to just abuse the system give orders covering lots of land, so your players would get the speed/power bonus.

Each player could request orders, and much more functionality could be added.