Being able to move from any solar system to any other solar system instantly (with some small amount of calculation time) would remove the element of locale from the strategic scene. This means that the strategy of ''hit ''em where they ain''t'' is much less effective.

The optimal strategy for defense would be to have some delaying factor at all of your star systems (mine field or something). And then have a (or perhaps multiple) courier-ship waiting on the fringe of the system, ready to jump at a moments notice. Perhaps constantly keeping another system calculated. This ship would then instantly go to the other system and signal for reinforcements. If the reinforcements are at the edge of the system and ready to leave it would take only as long as the calculation to go to the beleagered system and relieve the siege.

So a disproportionate number of resources would be put into spaceships for mobile defense rather than on fixed installations. A robust communication system, augmented by couriers and such, would also be a priority. Those fixed defenses that are built wouldn''t be a mega-starfortress that can take on a fleet. Rather they would be like minefields and asteroid bases that must be pulverised before they stop shooting.

Given all of this, the only hope for a side that is significantly weaker is secrecy. While the mega-fleet doesn''t know which system you are in, you are safe. Otherwise you are dogmeat.

-D

the dropship-heat-missile-laser thing makes sense except for the laser part, due to the scattering and absorbtion in the Earth atmosphere, possible substitutes include kinetic weapons, anti-missile missiles, and a neutral particle beam(while charged particle beam sounds like a nice name they become scattered as well-like charges repel, and any charged particle will become a little scattered going through the upper atmospheres regardless), I also think the dropships would be capable of having their own defenses

Atmospheric scattering and absorbtion is not really much of an issue if the power levels are high enough, as they could be with a weapon based on a battle-ready capital ship. Or a wavelength could be chosen that would not suffer these effects too much. And I was thinking of this taking place in the upper atmosphere anyway, where those effects would be minimal.
As for the dropships having their own defenses, I don't think this is really possible, at least not until it enters a normal flight mode. A reentering spacecraft would probably not even be able to detect an incoming missle, due to the superheated and ionized air surrounding it, and may even have it's communications with the mother ship cut off. If it did manage to detect the missle, anything it tries to fire at it would have to be fired in a downward direction, but all the lower surfaces of the craft would be acting as a heat sheild. Opening a weapons port in those surfaces would not be advisable.


[edited by - plasmadog on March 26, 2002 6:46:57 PM]

Plasmadog-
As for the meteorite thing, there is more than meets the eye All I can say about that is...keeping watching, hehe. I don''t mind discussing game ideas, design, and I''ll eventually even put up source code, but the one thing I will keep partially underwraps is some of the storyline. Sorry about the broken links, some pages I just haven''t worked on, and some I know I have, but they aren''t linking right. I''ll SLOWLY be working on the site as time permits. I''m mostly working on background right now, because that will actually help me fill in game design considerations. I think some designers like to think what they want in the game, and then work the history around it, but I''m sort of the other way around. I want the cool storyline and setting first, and then work the game around the setting.

As for how the Earth Factions had gained their Naval fleet, actually there was a period of peace and cooperation between the last remaining Autonomous Free Zones, and more especially, they started getting help from two outside sources. One was one of the Orbital Colonies...the Igaki colony. Actually, there happen to be two entirely different FTL drive technologies. While they both pretty much have the same end result, there are a few differences. I haven''t worked out the pseudo-science yet, but that''s another of the mysteries that has to be found out by the reader later

As for the concept of Orbital Drops, I borrowed some ideas from other sci-fi authors. First was the concept of disposable drop pods. Basically, imagine orbital drops to be the equivalent of EALO (Extreme Altitude Low Opening) airborne drops. Essentially, the troops gear up in relatively cheap ceramic and crystalline based pods that basically just slow down entry yes have very high heat resistance. Most vehicles, combat walkers ( icall them ExoFrames) and powered armor troops won''t need anything more than a basica shell, but infantry will need slight more specialized drop pods or drop ships to carry them down. It''s actually been my theory that the ExoFrames will conduct the same types of missions that Airborne unit of today do. They will land behind enemy lines and disrupt enemy logistics and support as much as possible before the main forces arrive. Their high mobility, versatility, and relative stealthiness will suit them very well to this task (remember, they are only about 4 meters tall, with some of the chicken walker models only being about 3m tall (think of the combat drones from Deus Ex but with cockpits to hold a human).

But you are right, the dropships will be very vulnerable, just like airborne troops of today. However, being able to drop units orbitally which can be stealthed, will be very quick, and even if the planetary defenses know that a warship flotilla is our there, they may not be sure when and where they landed the troops. Once the ground forces land, they have to haul ass to get to their intended targets. Half the battle will be getting there in time with as little scatter as possible.

I was thinking that the most important part of a planetary invasion would be knocking out the communication relay centers. Due to energy signatures that are released, it would be impossible to hide them...however, it''s possible that there could be an unknown communication center that was never used before. Also, the ability of the Free Zone Fleet to remain hidden is very important. Obviously they have a secret base, but it will be up to the New Earth Government to find it.

As for Anonymous''s suggestion of havig courier ships waiting with a precalculated destination, this is sort of possible. I wanted to have ships need to do calculations based on position in space, target destination, ut also have to measure certain variables like quantum wave fields generated by the ship and by local variables. So while some of the precalculation could be possible, there would still be some calibration time necessary. At best under good circumstances, the minimum time for a ship to jump should be several minutes to calibrate the Field Distortion Generator that will basically turn them into a subatomic quanta to the universe and allow them to jump somewhere else.

However, it''s still a viable tactic with a few caveats. Again, planning an invasion would require lots of intelligence work to eliminate as much of these possibilities as possible.

Of course, there''s also the problem of the McAlpin Autonomous Zones territory on Earth. While the NEG has Naval Superiority over Earth and has of course an incredibly large garrison there at all times, they have been unable to use orbital bombardments for political reasons. Nevertheless, they plan on sieging the McAlpin FreeZone (one of the major parts of the campaign) and are not concerned if the other Free Zones or if any of the Protectorates also decide to secede.

quote: Original post by Dauntless
But you are right, the dropships will be very vulnerable, just like airborne troops of today. However, being able to drop units orbitally which can be stealthed, will be very quick, and even if the planetary defenses know that a warship flotilla is our there, they may not be sure when and where they landed the troops. Once the ground forces land, they have to haul ass to get to their intended targets. Half the battle will be getting there in time with as little scatter as possible.

Well, I don''t think it would be that quick, a good 10 - 15 minutes for an earth-like planet. And reentry usually generates so much heat that the flame trail can be seen from the ground with the naked eye, so it''s hardly a secret. As one of those dropping troopers, I wouldn''t assume that my arrival, or my landing location was going to be unknown to the enemy. And I would be hauling ass once I landed, but not to get to the target. I would want to get the hell away from the remains of the drop pods, which would have a lot of residual heat for hours to come.
The use of many smaller drop pods though does go some way to solving the vulnerabilty problem, simply through safety in numbers. The guys on the ground couldn''t shoot down all the pods, some will always get through. With this in mind, you may want to consider the possibility of sending down a large number of decoys as well, to simply overwhelm the defences, and spread the apparent landing zone over a large area. This way, it doesn''t matter so much if the enemy knows your troops have landed, because you can simply hide among the clutter. And hell, most of those decoys will get through, so they may as well serve some other purpose once they''re on the ground, maybe as auxillary communication relays, radars, recon drones, whatever. They may not be there for long, but could provide valuable intell while they are.

That''s true, dropping in via orbit will leave trails much like a meteor burning up, but evem if reentry was about 10-15minutes, I think this is doable. If the Invading force chose the landing sites carefully, then by the time that aerospace forces were scrambled to try to intercept the drops, they''d almost be on the ground if not already on the ground. Ditto for ground forces mobilizong to try to stop them while they were landing.

However, picking the right drop zone will be crucial. The zone has to be far enough that the defender can not scramble forces too quickly, but not so far as to give too much time up to race to the target.

As for extraction, once the objective is claimed, larger dropships will land that can scramjet into low orbit where they will be picked up by the awaiting fleet.

Now that I think about it, the invading fleet will have one advantage in terms of defense if they start running late and the Defense fleet arrives in system. Since the invading fleet will have the luxury of knowing where they will orbit, they can preplant space mines as a deterrent. The planetary defense systems can lay mines too, but only in spots that they think will be good waylay points. Now that I think about it, it''s a pretty powerful advantage for the invading fleet.

I''m also wondering how vulnerable the warships should be. In modern warfare, a battleship can be taken out by a simple torpedo. It''s common sci-fi fare to have warships that can take loads of punishment, so I''m not sure which route I want to take. I think it''s possible to have both worlds....ships that can take a serious beating against some weapons, but be very vulnerable to others (just like modern ships are incredibly vulnerable to torpedoes today).

The most important aspect of warfare is logistics (turning resources into fighting power), and the most important resource is energy. From your definitions, the ships get energy from fusion reactors, so they need lots of deuterium for this. Where do they get it? How is it sent to the ships? The sources or the transport of resources are prime targets for either side - how are these protected?

A problem with this scenario is that in normal warefare, it is typical for the stronger side to get stronger (relative to the enemy) as the fight goes on, and the smaller side weaker. For every planet the overlords capture, it means they have more sources of fuel, and more sources of platinum-group metals to make more ships. It also means the rebels have fewer. Your idea has some similarities to Star Wars, in that it is always possible for the attackers to overwhelm the defenders and then run away, but eventually you start running out of fuel to do the running with. You will have to make sure that the rebel side is not too much smaller.

You might want to switch to some sort of infinite energy source (vacuum energy or some other buzzword) but that tends to remove one of the most imporant parts of strategery, not to mention remove any reason to visit planets or fight at all (you can just stay in your spaceship in deep space and drink replicated Earl Grey forever and not be found - space is a big place).

---
Grandpa Simpson - "I never thought I could shoot down a German plane, but last year I proved myself wrong!"

quote: However, picking the right drop zone will be crucial. The zone has to be far enough that the defender can not scramble forces too quickly, but not so far as to give too much time up to race to the target.

This is why I suggest you use the decoys. You can make the apparent drop zone so large that even if they do get to it quickly, they will have a hard time determining which area is the actual drop zone for the troops. You drop your troops into a 1km square zone in the middle of a 100km square region that has been saturated with decoys. The enemy scambles it''s air force and has to search that entire 100km square to find your troops. It buys your guys a lot of time to reassemble and go stealthy.

On the subject of mines, I''ve always thought that the concept of orbital mines was a bit silly, at least in the conventional "sit passivly until someone runs into me" sense. When you consider the incredible number of mines that you would need, and the basic limitations imposed by orbital mechanics, they just don''t make sense. Even if they were torpedo/missle type weapons that went active when a ship came in range, you wouls still need a lot, they would have to accelerate very quickly (and very visibly), and would give the target ample time to respond. Something like the detonation lasers you mention on your site make a bit more sense, one-shot devices that deal significant damage instantly at a distance, but if you do the math you''ll see that you''d still need quite a lot of these bad boys to provide even minimal cover. You could put a large cloud of shrapnel and debris into a highly eccentric orbit, so that where it''s orbital path intersects the orbits that are commonly used by military vessels, it is travelling at very high velocity. Of course this would restrict the movements of your own forces as well, and it is difficult to clear the debris after hostilties have ended, so would affect commercial shipping for decades to come.

When it comes to weapon damage, any weapon that does not have a good probability of a kill with just one or two hits is not going to be accepted by any military force, and will be sent back to the drawing board. It really bugs me in space sim games when I am flying what is supposed to be a bomber, and I have to pound even the smallest targets with half my weapon loadout to even make a dent. I mean, can you really see something like that happening in real life? Now, in theory a capital class spacecraft could a be hollowed out asteroid or something, with armor a mile thick, but even something like that could be taken out with a single matter-antimatter warhead. Not to mention the fact that all the operational parts would be on the surface and therefore vulnerable to almost any weapon. I mean what good is a weapon or a sensor, or even an engine, if it is hidden behind armor? Bear in mind when deciding on this matter, that when it come to spacecraft, particularly spacecraft in the process of parking themselves in orbit, kills can be fairly soft. Take out the engines during a deceleration burn, and it will likely slingshot right past the planet, or crash right into it. Take out it''s sensors with the flash of a nearby nuke or M-AM blast, and it is sitting blind in space, and cannot contribute to the surface surveillence effort. And of course, if it cannot see, then any point defense weapons it may have will be effectvly neutralised, making the ship vulnerable to further attack, or even boarding.

A few things to think about there. By the way, I strongly recommend reading the books I mentioned in my earlier post. It''s a strange story, and won''t appeal to everybody, but the vision of space combat in those books is the most realistic and fascinating I have ever seen. It will change the way you think about the subject.

You should read "Starship Troopers" by Robert A. Heinlein.

Also, just read an old article in Popular Science.
Hyperspectral imaging, instead of spy satellites that look at light that''s just in the range of human vision these things look at 200 spectral bands(10 nm in each band) in infrared and I think ultraviolet too. So far, they need daylight in order to get the full spectrum reflected back up to the satellite and don''t work when there''s heavy cloud cover. They work because camouflage paint won''t reflect the same as the vegetation in the other bands. Also, netting won''t work because the netting reflects differently than vegetation. It can detect recently laid mines because the disturbed soil reflects differently than regular soil. Also used for friend-or-foe tracking cause the friendly units could use a special marker. One commercial application is to look for minerals in remote areas, I suppose this is where Battlefield Earth got that scene from(it really was an ok movie).

I read that article too. It does seem to demolish the whole concept of passive stealthing, although I guess it might leave room for some sort of active "cloaking device" approach. What approach did you have in mind Dauntless?

By the way, I ran across this page recently:
http://www.arclight.net/~pdb/glimpses/article.html
It''s one guy''s thoughts on a few aspects of space combat. There''s a couple of interesting points that may not have occurred to you. I tend to agree with his assessment that ship to ship combat will be very similar to modern submarine warfare, involving a lot of stealth and patience.