Look at The Lost Vikings (1 and 2).

Did you all know that these games were made by the Blizzard team? Before they became Blizzard, they were called Silicon and Synapse, and when they wanted to release Warcraft, they changed publishers to get an all-PC audience. When changing publishers they changed their name too.

On the debate of 2D vs. 3D, I''ll bring up Blizzard again, in saying that not until next year (2002) will they have released a 3D game, and they have more awards than most people can shake a stick at.

I really want to see a neato Side scrolling action game that uses mouse and keyboard (aim with mouse, move with keyboard).

NATO = North American Terrorist Organization

George D. Filiotis

quote: Original post by Symphonic
I really want to see a neato Side scrolling action game that uses mouse and keyboard (aim with mouse, move with keyboard).

search the web for "abuse" i think you will like it. it is free and open source (the guys who wrote it didn''t want someone else to own the rights when their company sold out, so they gave it away to the internet community at large)...

--- krez (krezisback@aol.com)

"Oh, and the comment about there being too many 3d games is a little lame, since 3d is what we have been striving for for oh about 20 years...give me a break."

Yes, I know that it''s a great advance in ''technology'' but the point I''m making is that is doesn''t necessarily make a GREAT game. OF was great until it crashed every time I completed a certain level (then I lost interest) and it''s a good example of intelligent gameplay.

But what I''m saying is; it doesn''t have to be all singing all dancing graphics to produce a good game? It''s only my opinion that there are too many games that use a known 3D engine (Half Life for example) and create a mediocre game.

I didn''t mean to start a debate about 2D/3D - I was merely asking if one can create a gripping game in 2D without relying on flashy camera movement in a 3D environment I guess?

I just remember as a kid being completely engrossed in 2D scrolling arcade games whereas now I find myself ''plodding'' through games like Delta Force and Operation Flashpoint. Again, just my opinion.

There was a game that Symphonic descibes but I can''t remember the name - where you move with the keyboard but aim with the mouse, any takers? (I''m going to look in my CD collection tomorrow morning) It was a platform game, kinda like Aliens on the Master System... Hmm, showing my age

Ha! Just as I posted my message I got an e-mail about a response to this post. ABUSE - that''s the kind of thing Symphonic was talking about, no?

Yes, it''s "Abuse". But does anyone remember TargetQuake? It used the Quake engine to make a side scrolling action game. I remember first playing it and it was beautiful! It looked every bit as good as a predrawn 2D game (remember that at the time, resolutions were small, and so 2D art was not _as_ pretty as it is today). It was good fun too, but it was too strongly attached with Quake for my likings ... maybe they got around to changing all the enemies / weapons / etc, but I didn''t follow it up.

What i''m saying, as soooo many people have said before me, is that 3D graphics and 2D gameplay are NOT mutually exclusive. So, can you make a gripping game in pure 2D you ask? Hmm... let''s think that through =) Command and Conquer? Starcraft? Diablo? Day of the Tentacle? Ultima 8? Tempest 200? Okay, maybe not Tempest 2000 (it was 3D), but still, it is possible to do it. But even if there were no successful 2D games, would it stop you from trying (ignore that sentence if you are a sales manager)? You might make the first

Many people come to this board and say "Can I do this?". If you''re at the design stage, you can do anything. Don''t forget that.

Abuse
This is the most addictive game I''ve played in years! I downloaded it five hours ago and I''ve been playing it non-stop!

Anyway, that''s exactly what I was talking about. JY, you should look at that game my man, it''s a masterpiece. If you could take that concept and up the engines a few levels, then I would praise you endlessly.

What a great game... download it here

If you don''t you''re losing out...

George D. Filiotis

Yeah, I have played Abuse, but I think it was only one level (on a cover disk or something?)

To be honest I don''t think it''ll go the whole way to being published and everything, so I can indeed do whatever I want. It wasn''t really so much as a "can I do" question, but more of a "is there a market" question.

I''ve heard quite a few people look at new games and say "oh, yeah but it''s 2D" as though it''s some kind of let down. It''s interesting talking to you guys though - very encouraging.


Thanks!

In principle I prefer 3D, as it''s capable of everything you can do in 2D and a lot more. I believe there''s far more ''potential'' in 3D games. Saying that though, in practice, most of my favourites right now are 2D.

It doesn''t have to be, but it seems that a lot of games that go 3D sacrifice something in the way of gameplay to get there. Which is probably because 3D is still relatively young and has some maturing to do yet.

The future is definitely 3D though.

Abuse is great, just downloaded it. A version with slightly sharper graphics would be nice. On the subject of 3d and 2d, I think the gaming world has room for both. Clearly some games have to be in 3d, e.g; FPS, but others could (and do) use either to great effect; witness Red Alert 2, and Shogun. And could anyone imagine civilisation played in true 3d? That would be a nightmare to implement properly. There is still space for 2d, and if you want to amke a 2d game, go ahead

Speaking of Abuse, have you guys seen the project for Abuse2? It looks pretty damn hot! www.abuse2.com has some screenshots and it looks pretty nice.

The project is actually in SourceForge which is a great idea. If I were to start a project for my game, would anybody be interested in helping/contributing? It would be great for a lot of guys on this site who don''t know game programming or DirectX programming.
I was thinking we could keep the project at different stages so that learners can pick it up as it progresses.

When my ideas are a bit more established I will create a project in SourceForge I think.