What the hiring manager did was illegal in big way. Think discrimination and very ugly lawsuits. So all it took was one conversion with boss of the boss, and the deal was done. Imagine one of those discarded resumes had someone listed as disabled or part of minority.

That is illegal. If you had placed any value on education, you would have known that and acted accordingly.

Is it? Companies regularly don't bother to look at resumes too carefully, in some cases at all. When you submit a resume electronically for instance, some companies have filters that scan for particular words or phrases, and if your resume doesn't include one, it never gets looked at. Maybe throwing the resumes in the garbage is a bit extreme, but it's not functionally different from being filed away never to be touched again. And it's not discrimination to not hire people based on luck-- that's not a protected class. It also can't possibly be discrimination based on anything other than luck because the resumes were never actually looked at; how would the hiring manager discriminate based on information he or she doesn't know? And it doesn't matter if someone who doesn't get hired is part of a minority or has a disability, because that doesn't mean that they must be hired, only that you can't not hire them based on that alone. Which, again, the hiring manager doesn't know, because the resumes were not reviewed.

[/quote]
I could be mistaken (and please correct me if I am), but I don't think that companies are required to look at resumes, nor are they strictly required to make decisions based on them (Well, you're qualified Ted, the most qualified in fact. But I'm giving the job to my son.). What's illegal is deliberately choosing not to hire someone solely because they belong to a protected class. And even then, not much will happen without a pattern of that behavior. It's hard to claim discrimination because a single person wasn't hired for a job. The specifics of the story aren't so important, because I think that he point was that resumes aren't viewed very carefully, or necessarily in a way you'd expect.

[/quote]
That nit picked, I still agree with the others in this thread. It's hard to break into any industry once something like a standardized and accredited degree exists when you don't have that degree, and you will be competing against people who very likely all have degrees. That's a difficult gap to make up in the thirty seconds (max) that someone is reviewing your resume on that crucial first pass. That's not to say that you can't do it. But I think that conceptualizing a "fast" path for yourself to follow may not be as reasonable as it was when the industry was younger.

[/quote]
EDIT: Awesome, my line breaks show up in the editor but not in the actual post. I guess quote boxes will do...

Uhh comp science is an engineering degree. He can't just talk his way into a job in the field anymore...this isn't 1990. Pretty much anything he gets will be the same as the job he is in now.

He just has to wait till the degree is finished...like everyone else.

There are comp-sci related jobs available for students without a degree - if you know the right people. I already mentioned student graders. There's also paid internships, small contract work, tutoring and, if you're looking for an exercise in pain and frustration, web design for small clients. Large corporations in non-programming fields such as insurance, medical or manufacturing will often have programming internships, and nepotism abounds in such corporations. Ex: person A will help secure an internship for person B's son if person B helps person A's daughter's boyfriend get an internship. Will he be able to land a major full time programming job? Almost certainly not, but he can lay down the groundwork for such a job once he does have his degree. There's even non-job related money to be found. Teachers in particular are a good doorway to getting scholarships or grants. Are there as many opportunities as there were a few years ago? No, but they're still there and who you know is the best way to grab the opportunities available.

Well have you ever thought about going on a Rent-A-Coder type of site and doing some jobs? Obviously it'll be cheap labor on your part, but you'll get the experience and have a clientele and something to put on the resume.

I've tried it a few times but quickly lost interest due to the low pay for projects that would take months...

[quote name='Alpha_ProgDes' timestamp='1303257359' post='4800553']
Well have you ever thought about going on a Rent-A-Coder type of site and doing some jobs? Obviously it'll be cheap labor on your part, but you'll get the experience and have a clientele and something to put on the resume.

I've tried it a few times but quickly lost interest due to the low pay for projects that would take months...
[/quote]
get low pay for projects that will take days and consider the "pay" to be having something you can put in your portfolio rather than monetary gain.

[quote name='SteveDeFacto' timestamp='1303309372' post='4800772']
[quote name='Alpha_ProgDes' timestamp='1303257359' post='4800553']
Well have you ever thought about going on a Rent-A-Coder type of site and doing some jobs? Obviously it'll be cheap labor on your part, but you'll get the experience and have a clientele and something to put on the resume.

I've tried it a few times but quickly lost interest due to the low pay for projects that would take months...
[/quote]
get low pay for projects that will take days and consider the "pay" to be having something you can put in your portfolio rather than monetary gain.
[/quote]

Yeah but the whole point of this thread is to get a entry level job in the field that I can use to pay rent...

Yeah but the whole point of this thread is to get a entry level job in the field that I can use to pay rent...

Hey you have two options: quit your current job and try to network like almost everyone but me has said OR you can just stay where you're at and finish the degree. =D

<----------- The voice of reason

[quote name='way2lazy2care' timestamp='1303314079' post='4800804']
get low pay for projects that will take days and consider the "pay" to be having something you can put in your portfolio rather than monetary gain.

Yeah but the whole point of this thread is to get a entry level job in the field that I can use to pay rent...
[/quote]
You leverage your portfolio to get an entry level job. The projects I was talking about are small projects you use to get the job you want; the same way you'd use the project in your signature.

Till you get some more samples from your engine or some other side projects, just get a better crappy job where you aren't surrounded by people that are throwing you off the path you wish to take. Maybe get a job with the geek squad as all evidence points to not needing any experience at all to work for them.

[quote name='SiCrane' timestamp='1303201869' post='4800254']
The best way I can think of to get a job in your situation is straight up networking.

I find that networking is important in finding any job, regardless of your situation.
[/quote]
I find that networking is important not just in finding a job, but in many aspects of life.

[quote name='OneThreeThreeSeven' timestamp='1303224258' post='4800382']
Uhh comp science is an engineering degree. He can't just talk his way into a job in the field anymore...this isn't 1990. Pretty much anything he gets will be the same as the job he is in now.

He just has to wait till the degree is finished...like everyone else.

This isn't necessarily true. I had paid programming work before I got my degree. Nothing full time or long term, but then again, I wasn't looking for anything either. Some of it even paid much higher than my fulltime job after I got my degree.

You don't need a degree to get your foot in the door, but it does make it significantly easier. And once you have a degree and have had a job or two, I think experience overshadows the degree, the same way as once you ave a degree, nobody will care much about your high school diploma.

So, yes, a degree will make it much easier to get your foot in the door, but it is not impossible without one either (though it is probably a lot tougher). Without a degree you pretty much need to network, though, while with a degree you can fire off resumes to companies HR departments. Doing that without a degree probably won't get you far. In either case, networking will be beneficial (almost all of my job offers have come through people I already knew, one way or another).
[/quote]
I can only agree with this.

I started my programming career when I was still in university, during the internet bubble in the late nineties. It was easier to get a job without a degree (or brain for that matter).

I never got my engineering degree and later dropped out off law school, only because I focused most of my attention on work. I still regret it sometimes, but it likely wouldn't have mattered for my career. I worked hard and proved myself while extending my professional network. With over ten years of experience, I am considered for the same senior positions as my peers who do have a CS degree.

You just have to be able to convince employers that you're awesome, but you have to show them something, be it qualifications or equivalent experience. If you think you have the abilities but you don't get passed the HR department, try organizations that don't have one. A smaller company is more likely to listen to you in person, and that is where you can really convince someone provided you have at least a reasonable level of social skills. This is where networking can be very important: it's easier to meet and get to talk to a manager of a small local software shop than to get in contact with the CEO of a Forbes 500 multinational.

Regarding your portfolio: as impressive as all these 3D graphics and real-time physics are, they probably aren't relevant for most entry level jobs. I think you might have a better chance showing experience in more 'mundane' areas like web development or desktop applications, I can imagine it would be easier to find a job in that market segment. That doesn't mean you can't also work on game projects of course.

Good luck!

With over ten years of experience, I am considered for the same senior positions as my peers who do have a CS degree.[/quote]

Yes but you still didn't get the positions...amirite? Yes I know I'm right. I always am.

Getting considered for the position is not actually the same as getting the position. =D

[color="#000000"]I never got my engineering degree and later dropped out off law school[/quote]

lol

With over ten years of experience, I am considered for the same senior positions as my peers who do have a CS degree.

Yes but you still didn't get the positions...amirite? Yes I know I'm right. I always am.

Getting considered for the position is not actually the same as getting the position. =D
[/quote]
I'm considered just as all the other applicants, but only one gets the job. That's sort of how it works in the real world. Sometimes that's me, sometimes it's someone else.

So no, I do. Otherwise I can't explain how I landed jobs in the past and have a job right now.

Thinking you're right is not actually the same as being right. =D

[color="#000000"]I never got my engineering degree and later dropped out off law school

lol
[/quote]
Well, I did have a good time at least. Too good, perhaps.