Advertisement

I got beat up by a cop

Started by February 18, 2011 05:56 AM
114 comments, last by jpetrie 13 years, 8 months ago

[quote name='geo2004' timestamp='1298313125' post='4777152']
And like some of the others have mentioned, consider yourself lucky you weren't tazed or shot...although I think the story would have been even better had you been tazed.
"Don't taze me bro!!!"


I don't get why people think you would be less lucky to get tazed. I would much rather be tazed than punched. Tazing hurts for all of 10 seconds. A punch hurts for a long time and has a higher chance of actually injuring you.

Unless you're tazed running down a flight of stairs it will probably hurt a lot less in the long run.
[/quote]

How many times have you been tazered? I've been hit with them a few times during training events. It hurts a Lot more than any strikes I've ever had in martial arts. Not to mention you still have all the risks of serious injury if you end up falling in an uncontrolled manner.
Old Username: Talroth
If your signature on a web forum takes up more space than your average post, then you are doing things wrong.

I don't get why people think you would be less lucky to get tazed. I would much rather be tazed than punched.
Unless it's Mrs. Noriega behind you who is unable to tell her tazer from her gun (and who files a lawsuit against the taser manufacturer on terms of "I am too retarded to tell a tazer from a gun, it's all your fault").

But on a serious note, in this discussion, there is the "the cops are right, why did you have to act like a dick anyway" faction, and there is the "cops are Nazis, fuck the cops" faction (I belong to the latter one, as you can probably tell), and I don't think there will ever be any kind of consensus between those two extremes.

It is probably true that at least some cops have a hard job, and that at least some of them risk their lives dealing with criminals, and some of them probably even try to do the right thing. It is probably true as well that if someone behaves like a dick, he deserves being punched... kind of. However, in any case, it is not the cop's job to judge who deserves it.

On top of that, in many places the authorities (i.e. legal criminals) are not interested in actually finding the culprit at all. In theory, the police exists to serve you, the citizen, and to protect you, the citizen, from harm. That's what you learn in elementary school, and that's how it should be.

In practice, the cops are only interested in having the biggest "successes" (i.e. blaming and destroying someone, not necessarily the culprit) in the minimum time, and they will harrass and damage innocent people in their way irrespectively of what happens to anyone. Because, you know, they're the law, so they're right. And, accusing so and so many (no matter whether they're guilty) gets you a promotion. Criminalizing innocent people is more rewarding than catching real criminals too, because other than from some hobo who has nothing to lose, you don't have to fear retaliation from a respectable man who has a wife, a job, and a home.
I've once lost my job to these Nazis, though I've never broken the law even as much as neglecting a red traffic light. The only thing I ever did "wrong" was to refuse a "voluntary" DNA mass sampling. But hey, that's enough justification to spread libel at your employer and in your neighbourhood about you being a child murderer!
Almost a decade has passed since then and they've still not arrested or even interrogated me (or anyone else for that matter), so it would seem that the evidence didn't quite match up to the libel. And still, I lost my job and I had to move to another city. Great. To serve and to protect, huh.

So, you will excuse me for being somewhat biased, but... I cannot help but think that a dead cop is a good cop, and every drug dealer who has shot a cop should be granted amnesty and possibly awarded a prize (I'm in good company with that opinion, because certain people who used to say "if you kill one of those pigs it ain't no damage" three decades ago are now ministers in my country...). A cop punching someone who didn't commit a crime in the face should see some serious legal consequences. And that is independent of the fact whether that person acted "suspiciously" or not. I do agree that Prune's behaviour was was really stupid, but so what. You've got every darn right in the world to act as stupid as you like. Agreed, you might have to answer some stupid questions for your stupid acting, but hey... that's kind of justified.
However, acting like an jerk doesn't give anyone (cop or not) the right to injure you. Not unless you're a danger to someone else in the first place.
Advertisement

How many times have you been tazered? I've been hit with them a few times during training events. It hurts a Lot more than any strikes I've ever had in martial arts. Not to mention you still have all the risks of serious injury if you end up falling in an uncontrolled manner.

I haven't been tased, but from what I've heard it feels about equivalent to a stinger (pinched nerve), or a bad burn without the lasting pain afterward. Having experienced both of those I would still rather be tased than punched in the face.

I don't get why people think you would be less lucky to get tazed. I would much rather be tazed than punched. Tazing hurts for all of 10 seconds. A punch hurts for a long time and has a higher chance of actually injuring you.

Isn't tasing a cardiac death risk? My heart is OK but I'm quite skinny, with a BMI of only 18. Not sure if I'd have rather been tased than punched.
"But who prays for Satan? Who, in eighteen centuries, has had the common humanity to pray for the one sinner that needed it most?" --Mark Twain

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Looking for a high-performance, easy to use, and lightweight math library? http://www.cmldev.net/ (note: I'm not associated with that project; just a user)

So, you will excuse me for being somewhat biased, but... I cannot help but think that a dead cop is a good cop, and every drug dealer who has shot a cop should be granted amnesty and possibly awarded a prize


That might be one of the most disturbing things I've read in a while.

It sounds like from your post that you lost your job because you failed to agree to take a DNA sample? Aren't those types of DNA samples just a mouth swab? Sounds to me like you made a bad decision and are pissed off at the cops for it. Unless you have something to hide, why not just do the DNA sample? Assuming you were innocent you had nothing to lose.

But on a serious note, in this discussion, there is the "the cops are right, why did you have to act like a dick anyway" faction, and there is the "cops are Nazis, fuck the cops" faction (I belong to the latter one, as you can probably tell), and I don't think there will ever be any kind of consensus between those two extremes.

You seem to be the minority though. And I'm guessing despite the overload of programmers here, the predominant sentiment on this board is likely representative of the general population. And so we have the authoritarian creep of government and its agents continue unabated.

It is probably true that at least some cops have a hard job, and that at least some of them risk their lives dealing with criminals, and some of them probably even try to do the right thing. It is probably true as well that if someone behaves like a dick, he deserves being punched... kind of. However, in any case, it is not the cop's job to judge who deserves it.[/quote]
That was my point! Indeed, it's the sort of thing that crossed my mind when I decided to test how much freedom I really have in this society. Here's something people usually don't realize: the whole concept of rights and freedoms only makes sense when you have people in disadvantaged situations, because those that are not, do not need them! This is most often pointed out in freedom of speech cases where it is stressed how important it is to protect even the most unsavory speech... everyone's heard the "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it". This logic applies to other fundamental rights, such as that one should be free from harassment by the authorities and arbitrary arrest.

On top of that, in many places the authorities (i.e. legal criminals) are not interested in actually finding the culprit at all. In theory, the police exists to serve you, the citizen, and to protect you, the citizen, from harm.[/quote]
Now not only do I not feel protected, I feel endangered by police. This sort of incident, along with the abuse of other non-criminals (such as vagrants) by Vancouver police is detrimental to the civic fabric of the city's population, which is strained already as it is due to failing multiculturalist immigration policies.

In practice, the cops are only interested in having the biggest "successes" (i.e. blaming and destroying someone, not necessarily the culprit) in the minimum time, and they will harrass and damage innocent people in their way irrespectively of what happens to anyone. Because, you know, they're the law, so they're right. And, accusing so and so many (no matter whether they're guilty) gets you a promotion. Criminalizing innocent people is more rewarding than catching real criminals too, because other than from some hobo who has nothing to lose, you don't have to fear retaliation from a respectable man who has a wife, a job, and a home.[/quote]
This leads directly from basic insights into human psychology and an institutional culture which does not provide for sufficient checks and balances, and should be obvious to everyone, yet I am flabbergasted by the overwhelming responses I've seen here. Indeed, I can only count three posters that are somewhat aligned with my viewpoint.

I've once lost my job to these Nazis, though I've never broken the law even as much as neglecting a red traffic light. The only thing I ever did "wrong" was to refuse a "voluntary" DNA mass sampling. But hey, that's enough justification to spread libel at your employer and in your neighbourhood about you being a child murderer![/quote]
To see how far the system goes in trying to continue the monoculture and avoid anyone who might not go along, one needs only consider things like http://www.nytimes.com/1999/09/09/nyregion/metro-news-briefs-connecticut-judge-rules-that-police-can-bar-high-iq-scores.html "Judge Rules That Police Can Bar High I.Q. Scores"

I do agree that Prune's behaviour was was really stupid, but so what. You've got every darn right in the world to act as stupid as you like. Agreed, you might have to answer some stupid questions for your stupid acting, but hey... that's kind of justified.
However, acting like an jerk doesn't give anyone (cop or not) the right to injure you. Not unless you're a danger to someone else in the first place.
[/quote]
I agree it was stupid and I knew there was a risk. But I needed to know whether I could really count myself a free man. Now I know.
"But who prays for Satan? Who, in eighteen centuries, has had the common humanity to pray for the one sinner that needed it most?" --Mark Twain

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Looking for a high-performance, easy to use, and lightweight math library? http://www.cmldev.net/ (note: I'm not associated with that project; just a user)
Advertisement
So you provoked a guy and he reacted violently. Shame on you for provoking the cop. Shame on him for reacting violently. You were both wrong and should both apologize to each other (and at least one of you seemed to have had the decency to do so). Neither of you should act like that. You should take responsibility for yourself and avoid acting like that again.

I can't believe how right-wing reactionary all the responses to this post have been so far. I'm not surprised, just frustrated.

Stephen M. Webb
Professional Free Software Developer


[quote name='samoth' timestamp='1298320799' post='4777193']
So, you will excuse me for being somewhat biased, but... I cannot help but think that a dead cop is a good cop, and every drug dealer who has shot a cop should be granted amnesty and possibly awarded a prize


That might be one of the most disturbing things I've read in a while.

It sounds like from your post that you lost your job because you failed to agree to take a DNA sample? Aren't those types of DNA samples just a mouth swab? Sounds to me like you made a bad decision and are pissed off at the cops for it. Unless you have something to hide, why not just do the DNA sample? Assuming you were innocent you had nothing to lose.
[/quote]
"nothing to hide" is an old and well known fallacy that has been addressed a million times. Even if you don't read legal and human rights literature, as a geek surely you at least read slashdot where this has been debunked more times than you can shake a stick at.
http://www.computerweekly.com/blogs/the-data-trust-blog/2009/02/debunking-a-myth-if-you-have-n.html
"But who prays for Satan? Who, in eighteen centuries, has had the common humanity to pray for the one sinner that needed it most?" --Mark Twain

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Looking for a high-performance, easy to use, and lightweight math library? http://www.cmldev.net/ (note: I'm not associated with that project; just a user)

"nothing to hide" is an old and well known fallacy that has been addressed a million times. Even if you don't read legal and human rights literature, as a geek surely you at least read slashdot where this has been debunked more times than you can shake a stick at.
http://www.computerw...you-have-n.html


Well sometimes you have to pick your fights, either let them take your DNA, prove you're innocent and keep your job, or tell them to piss off, lose your job, and then complain about it.
As pissed off as he was about losing his job, seems to me like he should have opted for the DNA test...

[quote name='Prune' timestamp='1298323693' post='4777224']
"nothing to hide" is an old and well known fallacy that has been addressed a million times. Even if you don't read legal and human rights literature, as a geek surely you at least read slashdot where this has been debunked more times than you can shake a stick at.
http://www.computerw...you-have-n.html


Well sometimes you have to pick your fights, either let them take your DNA, prove you're innocent and keep your job, or tell them to piss off, lose your job, and then complain about it.
As pissed off as he was about losing his job, seems to me like he should have opted for the DNA test...
[/quote]

While Samoth's attitude is remarkably juvenile, I'd argue that he's totally within his rights to refuse a "voluntary" DNA test. That still doesn't excuse his idiotic "the only good cop is a dead cop" posturing.

As for the OP, you were an idiot and you got off light. Man up and admit you were being a tool. In fact, you're really lucky you didn't actually get the door closed on the cop. Think about it from the cops point of view. He sees someone hide something and then run. He chases them and they get into a building to which he has no access. Ok, now what? He has reasonable grounds to believe that something dodgy is going down and is duty bound to find out what*. I'm not actually sure what the procedure would be at that point, but I'm pretty sure it would have involved escalating the situation some way, probably with a call back to the station. If that had happened, you really would have been on the hook for wasting police time.

Seriously, both of you, grow the fuck up.

*or maybe you really are stupid enough to think he should just walk away?
if you think programming is like sex, you probably haven't done much of either.-------------- - capn_midnight

This topic is closed to new replies.

Advertisement