quote: what is a decent figure for a recent graduate just entering the UK game programming market?

£15-£18k is realistic, maybe less depending on your exact skills.

I''ve just been issued a contract for a programing job working with AGB/GC, which gives £20k + accomodation, with performance related bonuses and no set work hours.

I''m not a graduate, but I do have a years experiance of PSX work (through Darkhex) with countless years on the amateur scene, so we (the Darkhex guys are all being absorbed into this company) do have a broader knowledge than a graduate (not including any skills you may have learned privately of course).


This work is definately not all about the money, if it were, I would be programming databases or something. HOWEVER the myth that you cannot earn as much as any other programming job is exactly that, a myth. It all depends on your work ethnic, adaptability and having the deep desire to make it in the industry.


Good luck!







Marc Lambert

marc@darkhex.com

quote: Original post by mlambert
£15-£18k is realistic, maybe less depending on your exact skills.

I got offered less than that for a 'normal' programming job, but that was based on me having no qualification or experience. So that sounds about right.

quote: I'm not a graduate, but I do have a years experiance of PSX work (through Darkhex) with countless years on the amateur scene, so we (the Darkhex guys are all being absorbed into this company) do have a broader knowledge than a graduate (not including any skills you may have learned privately of course).

I think experience is worth more to employers (sadly). On a related point, It's a shame that more UK developers don't give their applicants some sort of testing, like I hear a lot of friends in the US getting. Instead, the people in charge of recruitment tend to just look at your qualifications and experience. The only company that ever tested my skills in any manner was Codemasters, and that was only a psychometric test anyway.

quote: This work is definately not all about the money, if it were, I would be programming databases or something. HOWEVER the myth that you cannot earn as much as any other programming job is exactly that, a myth. It all depends on your work ethnic, adaptability and having the deep desire to make it in the industry.

Heh. For me, £15k IS a lot of money I've lived on little over £3k a year since 1996 So I wouldn't be complaining.

Of course, you can earn just as much in the gaming industry, it just tends to take more effort/time/experience/skill to do so.

Edited by - Kylotan on August 27, 2001 10:27:58 PM

hello Kylotan,

When did you do the Codemasters test? I was there a couple of weeks ago and go about 2 hours of tests. These
included seperate C and a C++ programming tests, two logic tests and a test to check your gaming knowledge. I don''t recall a psychometric test though.

Did you really get offered less than £15K for a programming job? where at?

Paul

Wow, 2hrs of tests? Seems like waaayyy to much overkill, maybe that''s why some of these larger companies seem to be pumping out a lot of crap lately, because of the formal atmosphere around the teams?

In my opinion, all you''ve got to do to find out if someone is right for the job is to talk to them. You could spend the two hours talking about games and programming techniques, this way you not only test them on programming, but you can also hear them put their abilities across with their own words and see how open they are to new suggestions and coding ideas (also how they pick them up). You could always get them to bring in some code written by them, ask them to explain what it does - while checking over for potential (good programmers can always spot other good progammers).

Finally, this has the bonus of getting to know the guy sitting in front of you and see if they will fit into the current enviroment.

I got my current job in this manner and within one interview I knew the work was right for me and luckily they thought I would fit into the team well.





Marc Lambert

marc@darkhex.com

You wage will depend on a lot of things, your experience, whether you have a college degree, the location of the job, the size of the company, the successfulness of the company, etc. Thta being said, my estimates are a bit higher than most, I''d say 40k-90k US dollars.

quote: Original post by Kylotan
I think experience is worth more to employers (sadly). On a related point, It''s a shame that more UK developers don''t give their applicants some sort of testing, like I hear a lot of friends in the US getting. Instead, the people in charge of recruitment tend to just look at your qualifications and experience. The only company that ever tested my skills in any manner was Codemasters, and that was only a psychometric test anyway.

Testing is not given to every applicant; rather the resume is stage one of the screening process and only if you pass that will you move on to part two, the test.


Mike

quote: Original post by Anonymous Poster
hello Kylotan,

When did you do the Codemasters test?

Years ago.

quote: Did you really get offered less than £15K for a programming job? where at?

£12k at some small financial company here in Nottingham, but they were flexible on that. After that, I worked for £10k doing ASP, HTML, SQL, etc (standard MS web developer stuff.)

mlambert: Codemasters is actually not very formal at all, thankfully. I''ve seen some horrible places, though. Not in game programming: in other programming. You know... assuming you''re incapable of programming ASP pages unless you wear a suit.

vetinari: What I meant, is that I''ve been invited to plenty of interviews, but was only ever tested once. And I''ve never even been questioned on code issues, never mind given an actual test. Most companies don''t test at all. They just see the qualifications and judge it on that.

From what professionals have said, anywhere from 25K-125K a year, US based salary.

Hi mlambert,

The two hours flew by and was followed by fairly long but quite informal interview with a couple of programmers that work there. The impression I had from CodeMasters was that they are very professional company but with an informal atmosphere.

To keep on topic I believe the wages they pay for graduates entering the company are between £12-22K. The lower end being given to game testers and the higher end going to programmers and artists that have something special to offer ( A year in industry ect).


Paul

Game Developer magazine recently published the results of their salary survey in their July 2001 issue.

Check the results of this investigation:
http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20010831/survey_01.htm