Link

Quote: As the contents of a hacked climate change unit’s server in Britain were exposed on the Internet Friday, the event had some of the scientists involved scrambling to explain their emails and skeptics believing they had found a smoking gun. On the surface, the emails seem to indicate scientists modified data to fit the anthropogenic global warming theory, tried to silence dissenting opinions and reflect a concerted effort to restrict access to climate data possibly by deleting it.

Quote: Emails from Phil Jones, director of the Climate Research Unit, are arguably the most controversial. In multiple messages the director discusses his resistance to Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) requests even alluding to destroying data rather than sharing it. In one message he says, “I think I’ll delete the file rather than send to anyone.” Jones apparently considered ways to stymie or limit FOIA requests by “removing station data” and “omit some other countries” because “it would annoy them [those requesting the data].” Jones also exhorts his colleagues to delete email discussions saying in an email to Michael Mann, “Can you delete any emails you may have had with Keith re AR4? Keith will do likewise. He’s not in at the moment - minor family crisis. Can you also email Gene and get him to do the same? I don’t have his new email address. We will be getting Caspar to do likewise.” The scientists also apparently struggled to account for the cooling the earth has seen over the last 10 years. One scientist, Mick Kelly, discussed giving a presentation and rather than include the cooling he said, “I’ll maybe cut the last few points off the filtered curve before I give the talk again as that’s trending down as a result of the end effects and the recent cold-ish years.” Kevin Trenberth, a scientist with the National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR), was particularly frustrated by computer models that failed to predict the cooling. He said, “The fact is that we can’t account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can’t. The CERES data published in the August BAMS 09 supplement on 2008 shows there should be even more warming: but the data are surely wrong. Our observing system is inadequate.”

Straight up manipulating data to support their theory. Deleting data that doesn't support their theory. Misrepresenting data to audiences. Attempting to silence scientists that don't dismiss the data. Hiding the fact that the models that predict global warming are proveably broken beyond a standard deviation. Discussing at length how to suppress freedom of information requests that contradict their conclusions. Oh yeah, global warming is science not propaganda.

I had my last conservation class last week at uni. I was the only person that supported the "it's a natural temperature change that happens all the time."

One thing that's cool though is this "green" phase people are going through. I love the whole sustainable initiatives people have made especially in the area of renewable energy. I think that's a positive outcome even though the whole idea idea of global warming might be a sham. However, even if that's fake, humans are affecting the earth in numerous other ways namely overpopulation (but I'll leave that for another discussion).

I couldn't agree more honestly. I love the concept and technological challenges of harnessing renewable energy sources, and I agree that pollution and poor stewardship of resources is a problem that needs to be addressed. As to the warming itself, the earth has been cooling for 10 years straight.

I'd like to see some facts about this 'cooling for 10 years straight' comment. I've heard it said that 2005 was the warmest year ever by organizations such as Nasa. And from another NASA source2008 was the 9th warmest year since 1880.

Of course, because over the last 10 years some climate scientists fudged their numbers and tried to discourage dissent means that, logically, everything any climate scientist says is 100% bullshit.

Quote: Original post by Dreddnafious Maelstrom
Oh yeah, global warming is science not propaganda.

Some British scientists exposed as really dodgy, therefore all climate science is propaganda?

With logic like that, who needs science!

Quote: Original post by Dreddnafious Maelstrom
As to the warming itself, the earth has been cooling for 10 years straight.

[citation needed]
I thought the rapid increase of temperature had slowed/stopped over the past 10 years, not reversed!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Satellite_Temperatures.png
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Instrumental_Temperature_Record.png
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Global_Warming_Map.jpg

Meh, I don't see any "smoking gun"...

Quote: Can you delete any emails you may have had with Keith re AR4? Keith will do likewise. He’s not in at the moment - minor family crisis. Can you also email Gene and get him to do the same? I don’t have his new email address. We will be getting Caspar to do likewise.

Do you know what emails, specifically, they're referring to? Do you know what's in them? Do you know why they want them deleted? No? Then what's the big deal? Perhaps they were talking about how much they hate their boss, or how they've been cheating on their wives... I mean, they're talking about deleting emails, not about deleting "evidence".

It seems pretty obvious to me that the hackers had an agenda when they took those emails, so of course they're going to choose the "juciest" ones to actually release. But in all of the ones I've seen so far (and, to be honest, I haven't looked at everything) I can't find any actual evidence of a conspiracy or a cover-up...

So... meh

Let me first say that science needs to be completely out of the hands of politics and religion.

Now with that said.... Who cares if someone fudged the numbers or completely distorted the data? This has brought the world to actually take some responsibility for its waste, pushed industry to make more efficient processes, and has gotten technology to go the next level (or at least accelerated the process).

All in all, I like the results this "lie" has caused [smile]

Quote: Original post by nobodynews
I'd like to see some facts about this 'cooling for 10 years straight' comment.

Here's one link. It seems to contradict NASA data, maybe the difference is in how they define warmest/coolest.

Quote: Original post by nobodynews
Of course, because over the last 10 years some climate scientists fudged their numbers and tried to discourage dissent means that, logically, everything any climate scientist says is 100% bullshit.

By that logic, the antics of Michael Crichton alone should have been enough to get every Global Warming denier to hang his head in silent shame forever.

Quote: This headline may come as a bit of a surprise, so too might that fact that the warmest year recorded globally was not in 2008 or 2007, but in 1998.

But it is true. For the last 11 years we have not observed any increase in global temperatures.

I think this author was essentially saying 2008 wasn't as warm as 1998 and used that to mean that we have not observed any increase in global temperatures. That is, the author seemed to think 'if temp[2008] < temp[1998] then temperature didn't increase. Because at no other point in the article did the author cite anything else that supports this conclusion it could be an interpretation of the data by only looking at 2 or 3 data points.

I've heard it said that the 2000s have been the warmest decade ever... even if many of the individual years haven't been the warmest ever. No citation for that at this time.

I like how the author only mentioned one specific person who felt he had an alternative explanation for the change in temperature and the rest were just reffered to as 'sceptics'.

Also, clarification when I wrote "heard it said that 2005 was the warmest year ever" the associated link said that NASA concluded 2005 was the warmest year in a century because they included data from the arctic circle. Other research groups (I didn't check which ones) said it was the 2nd warmest behind 1998 with NASA claiming the other groups left out an entire continent.

edit: I've edited this like 10 times, sorry if anyone was trying to quote it.