I had $30 headphones and on-board digital audio. I got a $75 sound card and the quality improved tremendously. I got $100 speakers and the improvement was unbelievable. So I would say, get both. You can get a good soundcard for $50 so if you're going to spend the money on "good" speakers, might as well drop a little extra and do it right.

I'm not an audiophile but the Bose companion speakers blow me away. They range from $100-500 depending on your budget.

for quality surround sound gaming get a good sound card and stereo head phones with good bass.

The sound card will transform the sound into full 3d and youll get the best experience possible. Hear the bullets wizing over your shoulder.

If you want to listen to music / watch movies get a cheap sound card and good speakers.

IMO, if you are just using the soundcard for gaming and listening to music, anything beyond the one built in to the motherboard is completely unnecessary. Studio Recording is pretty much the only reason I can think of to buy a more expensive one.

Quote: Original post by Phytoplankton
IMO, if you are just using the soundcard for gaming and listening to music, anything beyond the one built in to the motherboard is completely unnecessary. Studio Recording is pretty much the only reason I can think of to buy a more expensive one.

You should try it. I am not an audiophile (I place "quality" of sound very low on my list of priorities), but I was very impressed with the boost of quality in replacing my onboard digital audio with an X-Fi card. Sound is much crisper and the effects are more pronounced. It added a whole new level to in-game explosions and sounds.

Quote: Original post by ChurchSkiz

Quote: Original post by Phytoplankton
IMO, if you are just using the soundcard for gaming and listening to music, anything beyond the one built in to the motherboard is completely unnecessary. Studio Recording is pretty much the only reason I can think of to buy a more expensive one.

You should try it. I am not an audiophile (I place "quality" of sound very low on my list of priorities), but I was very impressed with the boost of quality in replacing my onboard digital audio with an X-Fi card. Sound is much crisper and the effects are more pronounced. It added a whole new level to in-game explosions and sounds.

The interesting thing about audio equipment, is that it is one of those things where it's very easy to be content with what you have and consider it 'good enough'... until you taste something better. You don't know what you're missing because you've been missing it all along. And it's something you have to experience for yourself, whereas with something like a graphics card, you can look at screenshots and see the new features & benefits. Or where you can look at benchmark numbers.

Quote: Original post by HelplessFool
You don't know what you're missing because you've been missing it all along.

There is also a strong placebo effect.


Audio is increasingly moving toward end-to-end digital transmission. With analog you can legitimately make a few arguments about fidelity loss in cables and components. With digital audio signals you either have perfect fidelity or a lost signal you hear as noise.


I've helped people set up home theaters, and also worked with professional installers who hear of this frequently.

I have actually heard one person (and heard about many people) swear that they heard a difference between the sound of cheap HDMI cables and expensive HDMI cables. Both carry *DIGITAL* audio signals, and wire quality will not enhance the tone of the thing.

Similarly with S/PDIF audio signals (which are digital signals, not analog) you can spend $600 on a 1m cable that makes "Depth, detail, and clarity are possible in a way that makes digital sound more analogue than ever". Or you can pay a few bucks at any local or online store for some regular copper cables to carry the digital signals.

Many people will feel their equipment does better just because they paid more for it, even if there is no physical difference.

frob: sad, but true. Exhibit A

Quote: Original post by frob

Quote: Original post by HelplessFool
You don't know what you're missing because you've been missing it all along.

There is also a strong placebo effect.


Audio is increasingly moving toward end-to-end digital transmission. With analog you can legitimately make a few arguments about fidelity loss in cables and components. With digital audio signals you either have perfect fidelity or a lost signal you hear as noise.


I've helped people set up home theaters, and also worked with professional installers who hear of this frequently.

I have actually heard one person (and heard about many people) swear that they heard a difference between the sound of cheap HDMI cables and expensive HDMI cables. Both carry *DIGITAL* audio signals, and wire quality will not enhance the tone of the thing.

Similarly with S/PDIF audio signals (which are digital signals, not analog) you can spend $600 on a 1m cable that makes "Depth, detail, and clarity are possible in a way that makes digital sound more analogue than ever". Or you can pay a few bucks at any local or online store for some regular copper cables to carry the digital signals.

Many people will feel their equipment does better just because they paid more for it, even if there is no physical difference.

I'm not talking about paying through the nose for overpriced home theater equipment. This thread was pertaining to computer audio, and my reply in particular about the difference between the $2 worth of dac equipment that comes on a motherboard and buying an actual sound card for maybe $40. I'm talking about people like my mother who think their music sounds just fine on that $10 set of computer speakers or that tinny sounding $30 stereo system.

Besides, digital transmission is nice, but something has to generate the digital signal, and something has to convert it at some point [to analog]. So instead of buying a nice sound card, you spend on a nice theater receiver. The conversion has to happen somewhere. The big difference is that the receiver is a lot more likely to have good audio components in it than the on board sound on your motherboard.

>> I'm not talking about paying through the nose for overpriced home theater equipment. This thread was pertaining to computer audio, and my reply in particular about the difference between the $2 worth of dac equipment that comes on a motherboard and buying an actual sound card for maybe $40.

That was never stated anywhere in the thread. Perhaps you assumed that was the meaning?

It is increasingly common to have a PC incorporated to home theaters. It is also increasingly common to see very large monitors, 7.1 audio, and TV-tuner cards installed on home PCs.

The original question could very easily pertain to those media center systems, just as easily as it could pertain to your grandmother's speakers.

Quote: Original post by HelplessFool
You don't know what you're missing because you've been missing it all along. ... I'm talking about people like my mother who think their music sounds just fine on that $10 set of computer speakers or that tinny sounding $30 stereo system.

If their only need is to hear the error beeps, outlook reminders, and some occasional mp3s or other music, then the built in audio is a great solution. It is not a matter that "you don't know what you're missing because you've been missing it all along." Your mother knows perfectly well that she is not getting amazing audio from it. It may not sound "just fine" to you, but it may be "just fine" for her, meaning that the solution is appropriate and adequate for her specific needs.

A "tinny-sounding stereo system" can be an excellent solution if that's what meets or exceeds your needs.

That is why I mentioned quite some time ago in the thread that we must first know the context of the question.

Quote: Original post by HelplessFool

Quote: Original post by frob

Quote: Original post by HelplessFool

Quote: Original post by ChurchSkiz

Quote: Original post by Phytoplankton

Quote: Original post by frob
But first we must ask, what is this for? Is it a home PC that will be used for Word and EMail? A medium quality gaming rig in the front room? A home theater style setup? An audio developer or music director?

IMO, if you are just using the soundcard for gaming and listening to music, anything beyond the one built in to the motherboard is completely unnecessary. Studio Recording is pretty much the only reason I can think of to buy a more expensive one.

You should try it. I am not an audiophile (I place "quality" of sound very low on my list of priorities), but I was very impressed with the boost of quality in replacing my onboard digital audio with an X-Fi card. Sound is much crisper and the effects are more pronounced. It added a whole new level to in-game explosions and sounds.

The interesting thing about audio equipment, is that it is one of those things where it's very easy to be content with what you have and consider it 'good enough'... until you taste something better. You don't know what you're missing because you've been missing it all along. And it's something you have to experience for yourself, whereas with something like a graphics card, you can look at screenshots and see the new features & benefits. Or where you can look at benchmark numbers.

There is also a strong placebo effect. Audio is increasingly moving toward end-to-end digital transmission. With analog you can legitimately make a few arguments about fidelity loss in cables and components. With digital audio signals you either have perfect fidelity or a lost signal you hear as noise. ... Many people will feel their equipment does better just because they paid more for it, even if there is no physical difference.

Besides, digital transmission is nice, but something has to generate the digital signal, and something has to convert it at some point [to analog]. So instead of buying a nice sound card, you spend on a nice theater receiver. The conversion has to happen somewhere. The big difference is that the receiver is a lot more likely to have good audio components in it than the on board sound on your motherboard.

Sorry about the big quote, but it is is the series of statements that are significant.

Your final statement brings us full circle to the first question asked.

The integrated audio systems on most quality motherboards exceed the abilities of the dedicated sound cards of a decade ago. Many can handle high frequency 7.1 audio with both digital and analog outputs with excellent results.

For the vast majority of computer users, the integrated audio is more than enough for their needs. In that case it is almost exclusively the speakers themselves that make the difference.

Only if you have more unusual needs/wants (13.1 audio, professional requirements, or physical considerations) would the hardware become a major factor.

Back in the days when I was on the sound team for parties and events, I learned that if the speakers and the sound card were not plugged into the same electric network, the differences in ground level created distortion that could get quite annoying.

So, if you have surround speakers plugged into a variety of sockets, you might want to consider plugging them into a single socket (the same as the computer).

Aside from that, I can't tell the difference between a low-quality youtube music video and a $600 Harman & Kandon, so don't ask me [smile]