Quote: Original post by owl

Quote: Original post by trzy

Quote:
for example, for women and blacks to get the vote. It wasn't done overnight.

Bad example, considering the historic time-line, it was actually done overnight.

What?

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Asian countries have an ancient tradition (thousands of years old) of giving less imporance to masses, they don't want to control them, they just kill them and breed a more convenient one. That's also with individuals.

I don't know about that. The "individualistic" European has been far more bloodthirsty and concerned with breeding for the sake of social stability than the "conformist, traditional" Asian has. There is a big misunderstanding in the West that Asian countries, like China, don't listen to their people. They do. They just use very different mechanisms than democracy and violent revolution.

Chinese, for example, see their government as being quite responsive to their wants and needs in many areas.

When's the last time our governments gave us something we needed?

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Western countries are more Romanized (Greekizized, even Egiptized if you want) where the oppinion of masses and individuals was taken a little more in consideration.

Considered, disagreed with, and then slaughtered :)

Quote: Original post by trzy

Quote: Original post by owl

Quote: Original post by trzy

Quote:
for example, for women and blacks to get the vote. It wasn't done overnight.

Bad example, considering the historic time-line, it was actually done overnight.

What?

Let's just take the end of the roman empire as an start-point. From that moment to the first time a black folk was able to vote, how many of those years was anyone able to vote?

In the history of modern democratic vote, it was done overnight.

For the rest, I accept your disagreement and I feel no need to explain my points further.

Quote: Original post by owl

Quote: Original post by trzy

Quote: Original post by owl

Quote: Original post by trzy

Quote:
for example, for women and blacks to get the vote. It wasn't done overnight.

Bad example, considering the historic time-line, it was actually done overnight.

What?

Let's just take the end of the roman empire as an start-point. From that moment to the first time a black folk was able to vote, how many of those years was anyone able to vote?

In the history of modern democratic vote, it was done overnight.

For the rest, I accept your disagreement and I feel no need to explain my points further.

Democracy doesn't go back that far though. In the United States, it took a long time for black people to get voting rights. We'd like to think that we got up and decided to vote against injustice but the reality is, society had to be persuaded to accept blacks over the course of about a century after they were emancipated from slavery. The Civil Rights movement could not have happened in 1900, for example.

It's the same with gay marriage right now by the way. I'm all for it but I think gays have become overzealous with their demands which is why they are being stonewalled in the United States. It'll take more time before people see homosexuality as legitimate.

I think the point of this message "from China" was "Oh, how the mighty have fallen".

Whether it's true or false is another matter altogether.

That list is dated 2007-03-08. In other words, it's two years old.

These lists are part of the tit-for-tat between the United States and China. Sadly, the crimes of the Bush administration lend credence to this list. Setting that aside, the most recent go-around on the subject just happened this week. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton went to China. She said that while the US would always be concerned with human rights, the economic recession came first. This angered human rights activists. Whether it was in response to them or if it was previously scheduled, when Clinton returned from her trip, the State Department issued it's list of human rights violations in China: 2008 Human Rights Report: China. Almost as if on queue, the Chinese fired right back: Human Rights Record of United States in 2008. Skimming over their account, it's a laundry list of the social ills of the US. Sadly though, most of it appears accurate.