Hello, I've been sort of floating an idea around in my head recently about a turn-based, but still real-time, style of gameplay (I'll explain in a minute). I don't know when this will find its way into a real game, but oh well. I've been trying to find a sort of compromise multiplayer gameplay that will help introduce non-gamers into video gaming, and this is what I've come up with. I would like this to be workable in large multiplayer situations, as it is easier to enjoy a game (IMHO) when you're playing with friends. So first, I looked at turn-based strategy games, and found that they were perhaps too slow for big-group multiplayer play. Everybody has to wait for everybody else, and that's perhaps not enough engagement for someone to get "hooked." I then looked at real-time strategy games, and decided that a truly fun RTS (StarCraft) needs to be relatively fast-paced... but that comes with the danger that the beginner could simply be rushed and have to sit out for an entire game, having done almost nothing. My idea is this: what if there was a game, modeled perhaps after FreeCiv (and the like), that was turn-based, but also real-time at the same time? Explanation: the game plays by turns. Each turn ends when all the players have ended their turns (perhaps at different times, perhaps with a time limit), then the next turn begins simultaneously for everyone. During each turn, however, all players can make moves at once; in other words, each turn is "shared" by all the players. Units will have a maximum moves-per-turn value, of course. I think the advantage to this compromise of sorts is that it doesn't require lightning-fast reflexes and keyboard shortcuts and extreme skill to be able to play effectively, but rather favors more careful strategic planning, due to the turn-based nature; however, one can still gain an advantage by moving before another player in the same turn. What I'd appreciate feedback on is this: is this a feasible game mechanic (i.e. any conflicts due to the mixed nature can be reasonably handled), and more importantly, do you think it would actually be easier for beginners to pick up (dependent on other aspects of the design, of course), and would they enjoy the game more because of its slightly faster-pace? Thanks in advance for your thoughts!

The best real time turn based combat I have seen is PS2's Final Fantasy XII , which may exist in many other games I have not seen.

Hmm, interesting. I had forgotten about Final Fantasy, although my idea was more along the lines of being "RTTB" on the "adventure map": think, say, Heroes of Might and Magic but in semi-real-time. So, one would command armies of some sort to move around on the world map in turns.

Thanks!

I see your idea, but have you considered that it makes strategy almost impossible? Say that nation one attack nation 2... so on turns end nation 1 troops appear at border of nation 2, since they been doing other stuff not knowing anything they have no line of defense...you get my idea...
Its not impossible, but you'll have to work on those small parts concerning strategy...
Of course you could make troops move freely on your country or something this way it'll be always protected... as I said you'll need to think it trough, and I think it may change from game style.

Me and a friend on mine had a similar game concept but spread over a longer period of time (each turn lasting 24 hours.) The game was supposed to be like a combination of "tactics" games and turn based browser games such as Kings of Chaos. Each player would have a number of action points per turn, they would plan what they wanted to do in each round (move units, attack enemies etc.) and at the end of the round the outcome would be calculated, then if the path of one of your units and an opposing unit crossed a battle sequence would take placce, a number of "dice rolls" modified by each units stats and the player would be informed of the outcome at the beginning of the next round.

Honestly I think your ability to introduce a game to new players is going to depend on the subject matter, the amount of complexity, how easy the interface is to use, how much info they have to memorize and whether or not they can bring real world knowledge to the table (i.e., most should know what a knight or guitar is and what it does versus a hoplite or zither).

I haven't seen the system you're talking about in a strategy game in many years. It used to be called "phase-based movement" in a lot of the old wargames I used to play. (I think there was a thread here in Game Design about this some weeks ago).

Some challenges you might have:

1) What happens when two enemy units want to move through the same square?

2) What happens when two enemy units want to end in the same square?

3) What aids will you give new players to determine possible moves for other players (this could be very hard to do in your head if you're a newbie and you may want to limit the range of most units for that reason)

two words (or 3):

"Battle Isle 3"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_Isle_series

the "real time/turn based mode" was unplayable, against a cumputer at least.

I don't think it's a matter of "waiting" for your turn that is the issue. To quote my professor, "It's about making the other players CARE what happens during your turn". And, in some cases, giving them the opportunity to react quickly to the turn, even if it's not their turn.

Take Puzzle Quest, for instance. In an normal turn based RPG like Final Fantasy 1-10, it's not as big of a deal if you and the enemy take turns hitting each other. At the end of the day, you and the enemy aren't really sharing much. You both have your separate weapons and separate MP and don't have to fight for something other than your lives.

But in Puzzle Quest, you and the enemy share the same resources (the orbs of mana). You might see suddenly see a chain that could easily turn the tied of the battle, but it might not be your turn. And if the enemy sees that chain first, kiss your butt goodbye.

Another game would be the card game Uno. With everyone keeping their cards a secret from each other, it's always that uneasiness of who has the Draw Four card that gets to you when you play. And if you let people stack those cards like my friends did, it becomes worse because a Draw Four has the potential to become a Draw Sixteen.

HOWEVER... if you still want that mix of real time/turn based, then I suggest you check out Three Ring's game Bang Howdy. It's technically PVP in a real time world (i.e. you and your opponent are moving characters at the same time) but each individual character has a "charge meter" that has to be filled before you can give them a command.

Age of Wonders had exactly this system. They called it simultaneous turns.

Pros:
It lessened the problem of waiting for AI players, since they did the thinking when I did. This was very good for me since I normally don't play this kind of game because of the long waits on larger maps.

Cons:
In AoW it lead to a heavier CPU load which made the game lag somewhat more. Not much though.
Also the commands would lag because only one unit could move at any one time. If I click on a unit to attack it, another unit (which I don't see) might be moving so I my guy will move immediately afterwards.

Since you ended your turn by clicking on the "end turn" button, you could get some kind of deadlock situation where two or more players are waiting for each other to click "end turn". This is because if I'm the last person to click end turn, then I will have an advantage when it comes to react first in the next turn. This in turn could be a very big advantage when two sides both ended their turn while in range of a valuable resource.

Those where the issues in AoW, but I'm pretty sure each of these problems could be worked around somehow. Hope that helps.

All of this sounds very interesting, thanks guys! I'm actually a little bit inclined to agree with esrix, about the whole "caring about others' turns" thing. Considering the rest of the comments here, I'm not so sure "simultaneous turns" or "phase-based" movement is the best idea... but I still think it would be nice to allow players to do something while others' turns are proceeding...

Here's another possibility: what if the player was allowed to move units during his turn, but could perform research, change build queues, and so on at any time, including during others' turns? Turns could be limited to being very short (like 3 minutes or something), and that would allow a higher degree of player interactivity.

Even more extreme, how about this: players could "explore the map" (i.e. reduce fog of war) during non-turn times? perhaps using spy systems or something like that. Or there could be no fog of war at all: that might make it easier for players to care about other players' turns, as they could see everything the other players were doing.

Thanks!