What point did you get from 1.02 or 1.01?

1.04

Wai, I think the most important points in 01 and 02 were the announcement of the death and the narrator's odd reaction to it, and then the narrator's frustration and then success with rearranging the desk. The characterizing details of the dojo and feng shui are also somewhat important points. The water bottle seemed like it ought to be important, I just didn't understand the symbolism.


Anyone have requests for what the next workshop should be about?

I don't have any preference about the next workshop. I simply want to continue, because when the avatar comes in chapter 3, I would start need to describe the surreal world of the paradise. So far I haven't written about anything that is surreal. The current strand has this outline:

0.90 prologue

chapter 1:
1.01 introduces character Shin
1.02 introduces roommate
1.03 a small narrator-roommate dynamic
1.04 introduces the apartment
1.05 introduces character Tinh
1.06 announcement and rearrangement

chapter 2:
2.01 introduces roommate's parents
2.02 introduces roommate's ex-roommate
2.03 introduces roommate's material desires
2.04 introduces roommate's ex-advisor and narrator's advisor
2.05 library scene
2.06 another water scene, rejecting roommate, conflict at dojo

chapter 3:
3.01 the bell and the dojo

Quote: Original post by sunandshadow

Anyone have requests for what the next workshop should be about?

Do you mean the next lession within the novel writing workshop, or a new topic for a completely new workshop? If you're planning on doing another workshop, I'd love to participate, as I was too busy to take part in the novel writing one.

Quote: Original post by Sulphix

Quote: Original post by sunandshadow

Anyone have requests for what the next workshop should be about?

Do you mean the next lesson within the novel writing workshop, or a new topic for a completely new workshop? If you're planning on doing another workshop, I'd love to participate, as I was too busy to take part in the novel writing one.

I meant the next lesson within the novel writing one. Although depending on the topic chosen, it might be applicable to other types of fiction too.

You know how sometimes you grow so fast, and before you know it, your cloths don't fit? That is how I feel at the moment. My story is naturally anachronic. I wanted to introduce the avatar at the beginning but I feel constricted by the plot. I want to write in a way that allows me to be anachronic and surreal. I also had some more thoughts on how to spend the least energy to write.

If I were to suggest a workshop (for my personal purpose), it would be the art of decribing alien/surreal settings.


[Edited by - Wai on September 13, 2007 2:36:32 PM]

Hmm. Surrealism is not one of my personal strong points, because I'm very literal-minded and normally logic and consistency are what I would consider to be virtues of a setting. I've written 3 pieces which would be described as somewhat surreal: Salecina, Made Too Well Yet Not Well Enough, and Hybridize. But they were not surrealism ala Alice in Wonderland, M. John Harrison, J.G. Ballard, or Edward Gorey.

Mine looked surreal on the surface but had an underlying logic to them: The first had a 'secret' character, a sentient forest which could control time and felt protective of the humans who lived in the castle nearby, especially children. The second one was set in virtual reality, and the strange appearances of things such as the main character being a goldfish was just a fanciful layer on top of the normal situation of a data recovery program trying to cope with a failing hard disk. The third was surreal in that the 'people' were aliens with a biology somewhat like insects which required going through a metamorphosis at puberty. At some point I'll probably do one where the main character is actually wandering through another character's subconscious mind as represented by a dreamlike setting.

So either I cheated, or writing surrealism is like writing mystery in that the author knows whodunnit from the beginning and thus is not mystified the way the audience is. I'd be happy to talk about worldbuilding, but I'm not sure what I can really say about surrealistic worldbuilding if you don't want the kind with an underlying logic. But maybe you should check out the writings/videos Salvador Dali made talking about surrealism, he did things like working when he was half asleep to get in touch with his mind's dream-state. Other people have written really interesting surreal stuff under self-hypnosis whether intentionally or accidentally.



I do know what you mean about feeling like you keep growing out of your clothes. I think this is the thought behind the saying "writing is rewriting". Even with the best plan, your story is going to evolve while you are writing in, causing inconsistencies until you edit them away. Some people edit continuously but it's easy to get bogged down in doing that or stuck on one scene that you just can't figure out how to do, and stop getting new scenes written and making progress to the end of the manuscript. (I've done that so many times... x_@ ) That's why now I recommend not rewriting anything until one has written a first draft of everything. But then, that also doesn't work for some people - you should write whatever you have inspiration for, even if it's an inspiration for rewriting a previous scene.

01 - Rewritten

When you read something like this, is it confusing? What is the next thing that you may want to know?

It doesn't confuse me. Well except for this sentence "I have had a fair shape dealing with what I consider escapist." I don't understand the word 'shape' there, but I assume it's a typo or something.

Umm the following paragraph will be harsh, and I apologize beforehand. I don't like to hurt anyone's feelings or discourage anyone's story inspirations but I do want to honestly answer your question. And the answer is... I don't really want to know anything next because it does not strike me as interesting - who wants to read about an imaginary utopia when we could be reading about a 'real' utopia (real within the story) or other sort of problems that more strongly threaten the characters' lives, sanity, happiness, personal integrity, something which inspires passion in the characters and vicariously the reader. And conversely, so what if the writer succeeds in imagining a perfect society? Why should the reader cheer him on toward this goal, is there any interesting reward? All readers already have their own ideas of perfection, and they're going to be disgruntled if the writer decides on one they disagree with, or bored if the writer decides on one they're already thought of. The stakes are not big enough and personal enough. The set-up strikes me as self-indulgent, which breaks my immersion by reminding me there is a writer, not just the characters and the story world.

Quote: I have had a fair shape dealing with what I consider escapist

I think he meant fair share?

Quote: Original post by sunandshadow
Anyone have requests for what the next workshop should be about?

As I have never written a novel before, I don't know! I somehow feel that there is a lot more to be done before I can start writing a first draft.

One thing that comes to mind is the topic about narrative point of view... 1st person, 3rd person, past, present and even future, if applicable. Wai hinted on chronological verses anachronous presentation of the plot.

I guess the main question is this: Are we ready to start talking about these topics or should they wait until later workshops?