Hello, I need AI ideas for a game like Crimsonland I am wondering about Crimsonland AI. 1. I think it's using a special system for AI because if you look closely you see enemies splitting into groups and cover around player. How this would be achieved? 2. It uses a plain map (much like a standart image). There is no obstacles except player himself and other enemies. So, is tiling needed? If so, how big tiles must be? 3. Is there a flocking system? I am deeply curios about this kind of AI. Please answer. Thanks. Some screenshots: http://all-fun-games.com/reflexive/crimsonland/2.jpg http://z.about.com/d/compactiongames/1/0/X/H/crimsonland.jpg http://gameplay.com.ua/blog/wp-content/uploads/2006/09/cl2-development-shot-03.jpg

Anything? :(

I dont know the game. Since its not an open game, its kinda hard to guess how they did their AI. It could be completely hacked for all we know. There are many ways to do splitting into groups and covering, some implicit (similar to flocking), some explicit (coordinated). Tiling does not seem to be needed but could be used.

Quote: Original post by Steadtler
I dont know the game. Since its not an open game, its kinda hard to guess how they did their AI. It could be completely hacked for all we know. There are many ways to do splitting into groups and covering, some implicit (similar to flocking), some explicit (coordinated). Tiling does not seem to be needed but could be used.

Thanks for your reply Steadtler. But still i need some advices about my AI system. It hasn't to be exaclty like Crimsonland.

From your description it sounds like some kind of flocking system combined with group AI. I don't see why or how you would want to tile it, at least not how that relates to AI. For the algorithm, as a first approximation I would perhaps try to implement the following kind of behavior (purely hypothetical as I have not yet implemented any flocking algorithms):

Break up the enemies into drones and leaders.
Leaders converge on and attack the player but move away from other leaders.
Drones follow a leader and attack his target but separate to avoid collision with other drones.

Eh, basically what Steadtler already said. :)

Not enough to really go on in those screenshots. However, based on what's there I'd say that their AI is le supar dumb. It probably goes towards the player, tries to avoid allies and potentially prefers cover but I doubt it does anything more than that. The randomness caused by player movement will cause things like grouping and such in that kind of simulation.

90% of the time any "really smart" behavior you see in a game is the result of the AI developer allowing random chance to play a role in the AI. Most people create stories of intentionality in their heads when watching an entity behave. As long as there is randomness there, people will mis-interpret it as directed intelligence.

[EDIT: you say you want AI ideas for your game. Define "ideas". Do you want ideas for how the units should behave or do you need implementation ideas? Either way you'll have to describe your game in a lot more detail.]

-me

Quote: Original post by lightbringer
I don't see why or how you would want to tile it, at least not how that relates to AI.

I thought it can be used to prevent collisions between enemies. But yes, it isn't necessary. I can divide enemies into groups by their positions and then, for a specific enemy, travel across enemy group and check their position?

Quote: Original post by Palidine
It probably goes towards the player, tries to avoid allies and potentially prefers cover but I doubt it does anything more than that.

Hmm, I don't know. It didn't look dumby to me that much. Because it's always willing to cover player. But i think you're not wrong. It's first time that i want to make a game that much so perhaps i'm overrating it.

Quote: Original post by Palidine
[EDIT: you say you want AI ideas for your game. Define "ideas". Do you want ideas for how the units should behave or do you need implementation ideas? Either way you'll have to describe your game in a lot more detail.]

So yes, i want some advices about implementation of this covering AI stuff.

Quote: Original post by by
So yes, i want some advices about implementation of this covering AI stuff.

Start with what either I or Steadler suggested. Both perfectly valid places to start. You should have enough keywords from our posts to google out the algorithms.

You still haven't described the behavior you want so if it goes beyond what we've guessed you'll have to describe it in detail.

-me

Quote: Original post by by
I thought it can be used to prevent collisions between enemies. But yes, it isn't necessary. I can divide enemies into groups by their positions and then, for a specific enemy, travel across enemy group and check their position?
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I see what you mean. You could indeed use tiling for collision avoidance by dividing the world into a regular grid and approximating your entities with spheres to help reduce the number of collision test pairs. But I think it's more complicated than that - you might have to scan ahead based on the entity velocities or something. I don't know much about this (yet), but if you read the various papers on flocking behaviors you should get some good ideas.

Quote: Original post by lightbringer
I see what you mean. You could indeed use tiling for collision avoidance by dividing the world into a regular grid and approximating your entities with spheres to help reduce the number of collision test pairs. But I think it's more complicated than that - you might have to scan ahead based on the entity velocities or something. I don't know much about this (yet), but if you read the various papers on flocking behaviors you should get some good ideas.

Yes you're right, it sounds more complicated :) Thank you, I will read.

Quote: Original post by Palidine
You still haven't described the behavior you want so if it goes beyond what we've guessed you'll have to describe it in detail.

Hmm hmm hmm. I want enemies to move straigt forward to player. But i also want them to split and go around player. That's it. The game concept is very simple already. I don't know if i can be more clear for my English blocks me :)