Ok, I was just reading Dwarfsofts article on the Future of RPGs (nice work ) and as I was reading parts about talking to NPCs and in particular the line "What do you want to talk about?" an idea struck me (this is very rare for me ), because the line doesn''t really sound right (have you ever met someone and they say "What do you want to talk about?" as the first thing when you meet them?) because that is not how a conversation works. So what is my brilliant (subjective opinion {or is that objective, I always get them mixed up}) idea??? The "Brain Interface". Basically, there is a section managed just like an inventory in say Deus Ex, where you click and drag things into it, except in this case, it is the mind. So if you want to talk about an NPC Bob, you might drag a picture of Bob into your mind. Then when you meet an NPC and start talking, the computer takes over and acts out the conversation with the NPC. While this happens, the player (being controlled by the computer) would bring up topics of discussion in a natural way and the NPC would answer them also in appropriate ways. There are obvoiously some problems that need to be dealt with but the way my mind sees it, it could solve a few problems: 1) No need to use keyboard 2) No restricting choices ("You can say "Hello", "Give me food" etc) 3) The plot can still be moved along fairly easily since the computer is controlling the player 4) We have more power yet the player feels like they have more power. So what do you think? Would the player feel as if they don''t have enough control? (That is my major concern) As for the programming side, I don''t think it is impossible, I''ve already got the basic design worked out in my head which is a good sign that it is possible. hmmmmmmm? Disclaimer: Due to lack of money, not-so-good computer and moral dislike for warez, I don''t play many RPGs, so I might be leaving out some really big points.... sorry Trying is the first step towards failure.

The Brain interface?? Interesting idea to say the least.
But it sounds promising....

Your concern about players feeling they don''t have enought control with this interface really rests with how important the information they are seeking works itself into the games story line versus what topics they can discuss with the NPCs. (Be careful at how you hide info or how freely it is supplied)

If the only goal here is to present more interesting dialog with NPCs. Just be more colorful with how your NPCs present or hide their tidbits of info.


Just one question for now.
How are you going to present the topics you can discuss with a NPC?

That''s an interesting idea. You could even go further by letting the player construct sentences w/ different icons. That way the player doesn''t have to guess what words the designers used. All the possibilities would be right there, and the player can use them in different ways.


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quote: Original post by Nazrix

That''s an interesting idea. You could even go further by letting the player construct sentences w/ different icons. That way the player doesn''t have to guess what words the designers used. All the possibilities would be right there, and the player can use them in different ways.

It is a neat idea but you would have to have the NPC give hints about what they are capable of talking about though. Otherwise you would have to go through every combination with every NPC you find to make sure you didn''t miss anything. That could become real un-fun real fast. Maybe have the NPC ask innocent questions that would prompt you for different icons.

Example:
NPC: "Know anything about a guy named Bob?"
Player: Icon of Bob + Icon of Hate
NPC: "Yeah, I hate that guy too."
Player: Icon of Bob + Icon of Death.
NPC: "Good."
...



--------
Andrew

I had an idea similar to this about a year ago because I was frustrated with the way adventure games were so restrictive.

My idea was based around your memory, and everytime you looked at something or someone they would be added to your memory and you could refer to them later.

And then you would use the items in your memory for two different things. Firstly for talking to characters, like you said, either just selecting something to talk about or making sentences by combining items with emotions.

But secondly, to allow your character to "think" about things without actually having to do them. You know how annoying it is when you get completely stumpped and have to resort to trying every single item in your inventory with every single object in every single room. So here you could just go into your memory and try out things on each other in your head.

It wouldn't always give you the definitive answer, but it would at least eliminate the "Don't be rediculous, why would I use that item on that object" combinations, and for more likely ones it would say something like "hmm, that might work".

But that was about as far as I got before I started working on something else. I just kept a mental note of it to maybe return to later.

Edited by - Mechasam on November 21, 2000 5:15:11 PM

*Dwarfsoft makes a few grunts of approval as he scrolls through the thread*
*Dwarfsoft starts taking some notes for the updated doc*
Nice work raggy... Looks like you get another mention

-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft - Site:"The Philosophers'' Stone of Programming Alchemy" - IOL
The future of RPGs - Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche
          

Yeah, I was kind of thinking maybe you would need a memrory system too, either automatically updated or the player clicks on something to add it to their memory. If it were to be auto updated, then there would need to be groups and stuff otherwise it would get a bit too big to manage.

From the memory, you could then drag stuff into the mind.

The other thing which I originally intendid, was that the conversation didn''t stop to wait for your input, so once you had put stuff into your mind, and started the conversation, you don''t get to change it, although now I think about it, that may be better.

Another thing might be to change the mood, so you could talk in a aggressive manner or a polite manner or whatever.


Trying is the first step towards failure.

There''s one problem with abstract thoughts if they are represented by images. Symbolic images are VERY dependant on the culture, and it''s also much easier to misinterpret a symbol than a word. So, maybe you should use images for concrete things like a sword or a specific person, but words for abstract things like love and nature.

A few miscellaneous ideas:
1) Use words also for concrete things that you haven''t seen yet.
2) Include your whole inventory and everything you can currently see in the list of subjects. Eg. "what do you think of this sword?" and "what''s that tower in the horizon?" Maybe the conversation interface could be an overlay on the main game interface, and you could also drag things from the game view into the "brain." This would work especially well in 3D.
3) A "conversation intensity slider" that you can adjust, ranging from whisper to friendly conversation to rage.

-Jussi

Good ideas, I''m just thinking, how much extra work would be needed (for the artist) to draw like a 32x32 icon to represent every object/thought that the player encounters, and when this is encountered, the icon pops up on the screen. So say the player meets Bob, next to Bob, a little portrait of him would show up. Then while talking to Bob, Bob might mention a lighthouse, which then pops up the lighthouse picture on the screen. So the player then associates the picture with the building.

But some things you just could not do with icons you are right, so it gets a bit tricky there =)

Trying is the first step towards failure.

quote: Original post by ragonastick

Good ideas, I''m just thinking, how much extra work would be needed (for the artist) to draw like a 32x32 icon to represent every object/thought that the player encounters, and when this is encountered, the icon pops up on the screen. So say the player meets Bob, next to Bob, a little portrait of him would show up. Then while talking to Bob, Bob might mention a lighthouse, which then pops up the lighthouse picture on the screen. So the player then associates the picture with the building.

You could just use the same graphics as in the game itself. It would ease assocation, too. If it''s in 3D, render a picture of the object in real-time to icon form, or just use the 3D model instead of an icon.

-Jussi