Stay focus, don't let the drifting contents and imaginations distract you. There is only one thing you are doing and you need to do:

Express what you want to express.

Your situation is like a kid in a bathtub of toys. You want everything, you think you have everything, but you don't know what exactly you need to do.

Think about what is it that you want to express in your story. Then think about how to express it. After that, think about ways to express it better, and explain why it is better. And continue.

This means that you don't just trash your old work. And I am not talking about the writing of a story, but the design of it. So what you will be looking at will be outlines and notes.


You only get stuck if you try to go from beginning to end, or if you try to link separate elements together. As long as you think about a design as a whole, you can't.

One other thing I forgot to mention. When I'm writing, I don't think about the game. IMHO, you should use the story to guide your game; you should not use the game to guide your story. Forget about the game when you write, and just pretend you are writing a stand-alone story or novel. I think that will allow you to feel less constricted and allow you to more freely explore your design space. At least that's the way I do things. [grin]

Quote: Original post by sakky

Quote: Original post by sunandshadow
Writing a story is not the same as writing a game design. I'm currently writing a novel, an RPG script, and the RPG's design doc. They are all quite different and require different writing skills. Personally I would advise you that if you got a C+ in a regular English class (or less than 700 on the english portion of the SATs) you probably do not have the foundational skills to be able to write aprofessional-quality story, and if you haven't learned them by the time you are in college you are unlikely to be able to learn them. Instead, why not find a writer to team up with? Division of labor is the reason the human race is living in skyscrapers rather than caves, you know. ;)

You make it sound like I'll never be good at writing... I don't think that's true. I believe if I have the will to learn then I will succeed. I may not be the best at writing. I also may not give it that much effort either (like so in English). That teacher told me personally that she knew that I could write a lot better if I put some time and effort into it. She seen that because when I talked to her about various topics I was pretty descriptive among other things.

It's the organizing of thoughts into topics that get me. I've did a good job on most of my essays and got like As, Bs and Cs. It's more the final that did it to me. I just sort of screwed it up because I wanted to get out of that class because of things that were going on. Also, I had a lot of stress that kept taking my mind off focus.

I'm pretty creative it's just I get these blocks and get stuck. Also, I don't organize my thoughts good enough on PnP. So that's why I probably lack a few skills or it looks like it does.

That, and if I had a few good references that talk about the basics or format that a design should go by, then I could do a little better. It's sort of hard for me to just through all these ideas and things inside my head into a really good design or story line.

One thing for sure though, I never really got into writing until now.

If you are going to write, write. Don't discuss the fact that you think you can write based on old teacher feedback or because you have creativity. Just start writing. Writing WELL is a self-aquired skill. People can give you feedback but only you can make it happen. As Nike says, just do it. If you get blocked up often, you overcome those blocks by writing through them. Further, read from many different sources. If all you ever read is sci-fi, for example, you will probably suffer as a writer. The best writers of any genre are almost always voracious readers. Read British and American lit, read the classics, read political books, read history books. All of these provide sources for you to draw on in the future.

Estok, this precisely what I DON'T do!! LOOOL

I keep daydreaming, and nightdreaming too about stuff. Eventually, I hit something and decide it's worth noting, or remembering. And eventually, I uncover a note I did, understand it only partially, and dream of something different. you know, dreaming is what i use most when devising a story. Now writing is an entirely different ball of wax, granted. But I usually find it much easier to write when I know beforehand what is supposed to happen, and in what order.

Oh, and don't be afraid to read your previous drafts again and again. You might find something that you particularly like in it, and some other things you will particularly dislike. Analyse them, understand how they got there in the first place, and do it again. Or not, depending...

And keep feeding that imagination of yours, with everything you can lay your hand son, and keep writing, to express all your imagination came up with!!!

I've been writing a very, very long time for my age, approximately 79% of my life. Just sit down and do it. It's so amazing where it will take you, I'm not even going to go into approach, technique or style. I remember when I was a young martial artist, and the first time I had done something far more amazing than I thought I was capable of doing, and in that moment realized for the first time in my martial arts training, I had harnessed chi. The first time lighting comes out of your pen or keyboard or whatever, and you stand back and say to yourself, "I wrote that!", you'll know why I say it is amazing.

Of course, it is hard to do, takes a long time, vets out the wannabees, and all that regular stuff. But, amazing is barely descriptive of the things it can give you.

Adventuredesign

[Edited by - adventuredesign on May 12, 2005 6:20:16 PM]

Quote: Original post by sunandshadow
Writing a story is not the same as writing a game design. I'm currently writing a novel, an RPG script, and the RPG's design doc. They are all quite different and require different writing skills. Personally I would advise you that if you got a C+ in a regular English class (or less than 700 on the english portion of the SATs) you probably do not have the foundational skills to be able to write aprofessional-quality story.

the first thing to do is ignore that like she suggested in her next paragraph.
The SAT's are nothing but a college aptitute test. There is not a single intelligence test out there that isn't flawed anyways (because one thing psychologists admit is that they know very little about intelligence and specifically they know nothing about how to measure it.) If someone suggests this they are probably relying on the fact that they did score 700+ on their SAT to help validate their dreams of one day becoming a professional author because its all they got.

As for organizing your thoughts into a story I would go with Estoks advise; keep your eye on the whole so that you keep both your meaning and an overall cohesiveness to it. Start by fleshing out, on paper, what you want in your story; romance, drama, ect., ect. From here it is supprisingly easy to build, unless however there is a big turn or twist you want to add. To make sure that twists make sense and not pulled off post-construction (and everyone knows when you add it later because it rubs against the grain...almost always), you might have to build off the twist or build up to an end. Here is an example;

you want a boy meets girl/ boy meets world story.

Start with one idea.....boy struggles to find his place in world when he strikes out on his own.

Now add the girl.....boy struggles to find his place in the world when he strikes out on his own but overcomes adversity with love of girl.

Now fill in the blanks for; boy, struggle, place, world, strikes, overcome, adversity, love, girl.

Come up with something for all these that is overall cohesive (one should not rule out another and en equal number should oppose, and fill in what you need)

boy = main character
struggle = has trouble accepting what the world is after business college
place = where society wants boy to fit compared to where boy wants to fit
world = new boss, best friend, father
strikes = leaves college after graduation, takes job with friend through dad
overcome = solution boy comes to after resolving where his place is
adversity = boss is a jerk, expects boy and friend to become jerks because that is what he believes the elite do. Father also believes this.
love = love
girl = main love interest, main character(2)

put your twists in:

girl = daughter of boss who dislikes father
boss = learns to dislike boy when does not seem to adhere to boss's standards

now add it all together using all your constructs together;

(boy struggles to find his place in the world when he strikes out on his own but overcomes adversity with love of girl.)

(boy) has trouble accepting what the world is after he finished business college. Although (boy) and (boy)'s best friend get good jobs with a friend of (boy)'s father their behavior is unlike how (boy) imagined the business world to be; it is rude, elitist and unfair. When (boy) attempts to run against the grain he finds disapproval from his boss, his father and even his best friend. Now, with the love of the boss's daughter (boy) must push against his world and find the strength to break out and be who he knows he is.

okay, so what we have sounds a bit corney and dull but we develop the characters relationships and side stories so that we get a bigger picture;

side stories;

a.) Boy begins to see best friend changing to suit the job, must make ultimate decision to break off friendship
b.) Boss begins to dislike Boy, does not want daughter seeing him
c.) Boy struggles with his fathers wishes for him to stay in business

now develop a method for the end, decide on the qualities you want;
a.) Funny
b.) supprising
c.) good solution
while these are extremely basic they help us hash out what we want. From these derive your end.

Boy turns unfair business practices against boss to gain a foothold in a company the reader can consider 'good'.

Maybe boy even saves a company from boss's wrath and uses it as leverage to leave boss and stay on his feet with a job.

to make the company good lets add a 'good' element; we will say the companies owner is a generally good older man. However he is getting too old for running the company. When boss notices this he lies to the somewhat guliable old man about how the company is in poor condition, therefore he will only make a smaller offer. The old man accepts and even though boy knows the company would be worth some decent money he doesn't say anything.

We will put this at the beginning of the story, this way, when the boy goes back to the 'good' company and rescues it the readers have already forgotten it and are therefore 'supprised' by the event. We have now fullfilled b & c, a will come in how it is written.

add this to the story, along with the side plots and write it as a plan and NOT a teaser to the story. Even in an bulleted list organized chronologically.

- boy gets out of college
- boy and friend get work with one of boys fathers friends
- on boys first day boy watches boss lie to a very nice old man about the state of his company. Boy regrets not saying anything because the man is so gulliable but does nothing.
- boy starts to speak out against boss the next few weeks at job. He becomes ostrecized (no clue how to spell that) by friend, boss and father is very displeased with him.
- boy meets girl
- boy finds strength in girls freespirited opinions about her fathers 'evilness', enough to stop him from second guessing himself
- boy begins to push against dad and friend
- deals with dating girl who he is not supposed to be dating because her dad (his boss) does not like him.
- Fight with friend over the friend becoming mean like the boss
- Friend tells boss that boy is still seeing his daughter
- boss threatens to fire boy and gets mad at boy's dad.
- Boys dad gets truly upset, boy backs down, agrees to stop seeing girl
- some sort of reminder sparks boy to want girl back
- boy tells father off
- boy shows up at office and talks gulliable company owner from beginning of script into rethinking a business plan.
- boy fired/quits
- boy gets girl

now I understand that this is anticlimatic, that is where this step comes in, refining. Add details here, definately find something to replace "some sort of reminder sparks boy to want girl back" and "boy fired/ quits"

- boy gets out of college
- boy and friend get work with one of boys fathers friends
- on boys first day boy watches boss lie to a very nice old man about the state of his company. Boy regrets not saying anything because the man is so gulliable but does nothing.
- as gulliable man walks out of office boy is conforted by the fact that all the nice people in the office (secretaries, other business people ect) all truly like gulliable man, all very concerned about him.
- when boss walks back through office yells at people not to talk to gullaible man, is generally mean.
- boy starts to speak out against boss the next few weeks at job. He becomes ostrecized (no clue how to spell that) by friend, boss and father is very displeased with him.
- boy meets girl
- boy finds strength in girls freespirited opinions about her fathers 'evilness', enough to stop him from second guessing himself
- boy begins to push against dad and friend
- deals with dating girl who he is not supposed to be dating because her dad (his boss) does not like him.
- while out on date boy and girl pick up a stray dog. touched by boys sensitivity girl starts falling for him.
- Fight with friend over the friend becoming mean like the boss
- Friend tells boss that boy is still seeing his daughter
- boss threatens to fire boy and gets mad at boy's dad.
- stray dog living with boy is taken away by owner who is visiable mean to it.
- Boys dad gets truly upset, boy backs down, agrees to stop seeing girl
- while at the park being depressed boy sees stray dogs owner kick it. Boy punchs owner in the face, takes dog. Understands that sometimes confrontation is what it takes.
- boy tells father off
- boy shows up at office and talks gulliable company owner from beginning of script into rethinking a business plan.
- When boy goes to leave office boss is being extremely harsh, punches at boy. Office people who love gulliable old man and hate boss quit and go with boy to help gulliable mans company.
- boy gets girl because boy found his place, resolved his character issues and proved it to girl.

Now since its 4:00 AM I wont go any further, suffice it to say that you continue refining the story and eventually you will hash out the details of each scene whist keeping the whole organized. Its my method, might not be the best method (ive never really presented it before so nobody had ever commented on it). And while this is an extremely basic example it is only to show the process. Very detailed and complicated things can come of it if you want, but they might be better suited to another type of story designing method. Also please dont judge the method on the simpleness of the story it produced, it took me only the time it took me to post, just thought it up off the top of my head so its not exactly a shinning example. Anyways, good luck!

lastly remember that there is a TON of stuff I didn't do that you would be better off doing, like making a detailed description of the characters personalities so that you can keep them in character. Like one of the main parts of this story would be the boy resolving the character flaw of being prone to depression versus taking action(I just didn't have the time.)

Here's something I learn from a post by SnS: write emotions.

Think of how to write the story so that the reader can experience emotions: happiness, sadness, danger(suspense), embarassing, anger, and other emotions.

Quote: Original post by slowpid
The SAT's are nothing but a college aptitute test. There is not a single intelligence test out there that isn't flawed anyways (because one thing psychologists admit is that they know very little about intelligence and specifically they know nothing about how to measure it.) If someone suggests this they are probably relying on the fact that they did score 700+ on their SAT to help validate their dreams of one day becoming a professional author because its all they got.

If someone has ever told you "Anyone can be a writer." or "Writing a novel is easy.", that's total bullshit. Writing good fiction is as difficult as becoming an expert at calculus or a professional athlete, and takes a similar investment of time and effort.

The english portion of the SATs tests, among other things, one's knowledge of what various words mean. No one, no matter how creative or determinde, can be a professional writer if they don't have knowledge of and control over their medium, words. Just like any other artist, a writer must have a solid grasp on the mundaneties of vocabulary, grammar, punctuatuin, etc. so that they don't have to be always worrying about these, and can instead devote thair brainpower to the complexities of character, plot, worldbuilding, etc.

In earning my BA in English and going to various conventions and conferences I have met lots of writers. Statistically, almost all of them read voraciously as children, always had a reading level years above that of their age group, had a high reading speed, scored above 700 on the english portion of their SATs, and started writing fiction before age 15. There are certain things that the human brain is not as good at learnng after puberty. Just like studying music as a child causes people to have a more accurate sense of pitch as an adult, and studying a foreign language as a child makes someone more fluent and accentless as an adult, pouring a river of fiction through one's mind as a child 'tunes' one's brain to the structures and tones of fiction, giving one better subsconscious writing instincts as an adult. I'm not saying any of this is essential to being a good writer, I am saying that these are symptoms indicating which people are likely to become a professional-quality writer. I would also like to point out that 10 years is a very common length of time to study writing before one is capable of writing a publishable novel.

Someone who only decides they want to try writing in college is unlikely to have a high enough level of grammatical competence for the mechanics of writing to be easy for them or enough investment in the idea of being a writer to spend 10 years studying the field; thus they are unlikely to ever become a professional writer. There are always exceptions, but this is the overall statistical picture of who becomes a professional-quality writer and who doesn't.

no one said it was easy but given enough time anyone can do it. For example, when I was in 6th grade I was found to have a college level reading ability while my friend was found to have a 'normal' reading ability. Now, in college my friend can write cirlces around me because he practiced more than I did.

His girlfriend also scored a 1550 on the SAT (and is admittedly the most driven person I know) however in terms of smarts she is left behind by him. Anyone with ten years under their belt is likely to be a very good writer if they truly are passionate about their writing. Professionalism, I understand, is the upper esscehlon (fuck I cant spell that word) of those people, but not unattainable by anyone with average intelligence.

"There are always exceptions, but this is the overall statistical picture of who becomes a professional-quality writer and who doesn't."

SnS I would truly love to see that statistic and the valid report that claims it. Please please dont disapoint me on this one! I am extremely interested on where you get your information because sometimes it seems as if you are making it up off the top of my head from your own experiences....a place we know to be biased and therefore not information but opinion.