Hi, Im Mark St. Jean, programmer for ShoeString Games (A Subsidiary of EDI Game: Ethereal Darkness Interactive), I am only Seventeen years old. I have recently been given a great opportunity in this business and I would like to express myself here a little bit and get some positive feedback relating back to this topic. Let me unwind and get started here. I myself have currently been given one of the greatest opportunities of my life. I've been an independent game developer for about two years now. I have yet to reach gold on any project of mine, or my former development groups. Through GameDev I have met a local here. His name is Raymond of EDI Game: Ethereal Darkness Interactive. He has taken or former mislead team (known as WastedInk) and turn us into, as of right now, a well organized and dedicated team now known as ShoeString Games. We went from a lackluster 2D game and are currently working on a beautiful 2D Isometric RPG using EDI Games' Flare 3.0 engine. It is currently in development with ShoeString Games under the supervision and direction of EDI Games. We have been given almost complete control of our project, down to what things are meant to look like, to the level design, even to the heart of the game, the story itself. This opportunity we have been given is so amazing to us we feel that we should take advantage of this opportunity. Going from a hobby project to a future commercial game is a large step for us and we want to address a few problems with the way the gaming industry is going at this current time. Let me elaborate. If you were to go into a video game retailer and look on the shelf's you would see what I would consider a tragedy to our industry. In the past year we have come to see the release of the same game over and over again with slight changes. There was somewhere of 5+ W.W.II games release, as well as the recent release of Dynasty Warriors 5 and Kessen III (which after reading about and checking reviews are the exact same games as there predecessors). It seems that our industry is stuck in a rut where we cannot successfully release unique games without severe risk. Some independent developers have stuck gold, such as the release of Katamiri Demochy* and Alien Hominid. It seems to me that there aren't that many developers striving to make unique games that can give new enjoyment back into the gamer but would rather go with something already tested and approved by the fans based on previous sales. This brings me to my point. In the position I have been handed and the freedom of our project that we have control of I ask if it is safe to try something new in an already tainted genre. We are currently developing an RPG that we see as being unique to the market. Something that we haven't seen before in the gaming industry. With gameplay and story involved we believe that we can create something that nobody has played before and will enjoy as much as the first time they played an RPG, or an adventure game, or even a sports game. We are striving to put originality into gaming these days. What I am trying to do is cause an awareness of the problem I believe we are facing and create a positive discussion of things that we can do to prevent and change the state of things. I will start: Our Project: PRO - We are using a story telling approach that we believe has never been used in gaming before. Our story isn't focused on the cliche of "The one destined hero realizes that he must save the world" or "The lead character takes his sword, runs into a mob of enemies, and for the first battle of his life seems to be able to tap into a classic power known as 'magic' that nobody in the world except for your enemies and teammates knows exists." We are also using different types of gameplay for an 2D Isometric RPG that strays from the point and click, go from point A to B, kill this boss, and move on. We believe our vision not only pokes fun at the cliches but creates an atmosphere and emotional connection that lures the player into the game, similar to a feeling you would get the first time you watched your favorite movie, heard your favorite song, or saw your favorite movie. We are also not striving for a number one seller. We are aiming to create a fun gameplay experience, even if that mean making a 10 hour RPG instead of dragging itself out with repetitiveness and every so often dropping in a shocking moment to convince you that you must keep playing through the boring parts just to see what's next. CON - Creating a 2D Isometric RPG is not only dated for its time but it has been done to death. We are trying to counteract this problem with giving off an art direction that hasn't really been used a lot or even used at all. We are also trying to create a more involving world where you aren't just walking around a "map" or an "area" but you are actually experiencing the character in this world that you have never seen before. I ask you, shed your insight on this problem, or what you see can change the way things are going these days.

First of all, congrats!..I hope it turns out well.

Quote: I ask if it is safe to try something new in an already tainted genre. We are currently developing an RPG that we see as being unique to the market. Something that we haven't seen before in the gaming industry.

Anything's possible.... but not probable if you intend using someone else's money and your team doesn't have the expertise to complete the project.

Quote: It seems to me that there aren't that many developers striving to make unique games that can give new enjoyment back into the gamer but would rather go with something already tested and approved by the fans based on previous sales.

This is what running a business is all about - making money!. Many developers cannot afford to throw money away on a project that's not going to sell enough units or possibly see profit at the end of the day, particularly if the developer is using investors' money or bank loans etc. Even some publishers are reticent on taking on something unique, as you claim your game would be, because they have to look at how it can be marketed successfully and how much profit they can make from it, obviously if it's absolutely brilliant then this wouldn't apply.

It's a very risky business and development studios (even seemingly successful ones) are going to the wall.

Good luck!

Thankfully our development strategies for both EDIGames and, ShoeString Games are to take chances. It is unlikely that we would be able to take a Triple-A game, and copy it to a degree that meets or surpasses it's it's model; nor would we wan't to, since that is not what we are about.

Instead, we try to focus on the strengths and wants of the developers, the programmers, designers, artists and musicans that make up the team. By allowing them to follow and implement thier dreams, you not only get a very dedicated team, but you also get a game with many eclectic (some might say chaotic) themes and features. The project leader (idealy the person with biggest overall vision of how things should be) directs thier talents, so that they fit as well as possible into the final product.

"How can you afford to do this?" I hear you ask. It is simple =)

Our game development machine is run off of the raw talent, effort, and determination of it's members, the budget for both Morning's Wrath, and now ShoeString Game's project, is $0.00

We must make due with what we have, which at first wasn't much, but now, given that we have a stable development platform (namely the Flare 3.0 game engine) and a suite of tools for it, it is mostly down to creativity.

To sum things up =D, I guess you will just have to see what comes from our indie-game-wizardry =)

No, indies don't stand a chance in the current market. Good luck!

Just to disagree with the last poster....

We are an indie developer. 1 programmer, 1 designer, a part time artist & business manager. We've just signed a deal with a major European publisher for pan European distribution, a Canadian based published for north American distribution & will soon sign a Russian deal.

Admittedly its take 4 years & 4 games to get to the point where publishers want to work with us, but if you have the time, energy & resources to do it, then it can work.

These deals will pay for 1-2 years of running costs for us, based on the advances alone.

The biggest problem most indies face is the business side. That's one area where we are very strong. It doesn't matter how good your games are if your contracts are badly written and open to exploitation. Having someone who can sell and negotiate is absolutely critical. You must also ensure you are targetting an appropriate market if you want to be financially successful. Most indie will fail because of their lack of business skills rather than the quality of their games.

If you're doing it for fun, then you can ignore all that!

Iain McNeil
Director
Slitherine Software
www.slitherine.co.uk

Quote: These deals will pay for 1-2 years of running costs for us, based on the advances alone

Ah, don't forget that advances from publishers are usually recoupable before the developer gets any revenues - this is when it can be very tricky to stay in business if you've spent all your advances during development and before revenues start coming in.

The point is we funded the game to completion & then sold it. That money is for the next 1-2 years for new games.

I agree that's the trap many developers get caught in, but I think its because they start too big. Start small and grow - its much much safer!

Iain McNeil
Director
Slitherine Software

question to Iain McNeil: Do you pay your team members? If not where did you find business manager (talented I assume) who works for free?

My dad actually helps a lot with the business side as he is retired now. We do pay the team, we're on our 5th game now and breaking even, but it did take a year amd a half of no income to get started. Hopefully we'll be in to profit soon!

Iain McNeil
Director
Slitherine Software

Quote: Original post by Anonymous Poster
No, indies don't stand a chance in the current market. Good luck!

Leave to the AP to post something useless.

"are indies safe taking chances?" is somewhat of an oxymoron. Taking chances is inherently risky -- there is nothing safe about it. Infact taking chances on radical/new/unproven game designs is riskier than simply cloning an already successful title. The "safe" bet from a proven gameplay standpoint would be to copy an existing game design.

This logic is shortsighted IMO.

Relative to large, established competitors indies have less money, fewer people, few contacts, no publishers, no distribution medium, a lack of attorneys, no IP from other mediums (such as moives), etc. Indies cannot compete on any of these areas of game development. They infact only have one area where they can have a competitive advantage: taking risks.

Big companies are naturally risk adverse. They have millions already invested and stockholders to answer to. This creates an atmosphere where companies tend to create lots of sequals (you know, all those games with the 2s, 3s, and 4s at the end of their name) or port existing franchises from other mediums (again movies, actors, musicians , etc). This is the "safe bet" for big companies. I saw a piece on one of the cable news channels just yesterday about big game companies (EA and Vivendi were cited) as digging in the movie archives to base new games based on old movies. I don't know about you guys, but i'm not in any hurry to see Tom Hanks face in the PC game version of "Splash". Again, big/established game companies tend to focus on existing franchises rather than invent new ones.

This IS the only area where indies have any hope of competing. You don't have millions already invested so there isn't alot (relatively) to lose, and everything to gain. You also don't have legions of shareholders and a fiduciary responsibility to keep the company out of bankruptcy court. So it's not a matter of whether indies can afford to take chances on radical new stories, gameplay features, settings, etc. They MUST take chances if they have any hope of succeeding in the marketplace. Again there's plenty of money making something "just like quake, but a little bit different", but this is exactly the same way big companies think and they have all the resources that indies don't have to make it succeed.

So my advice is take chances. If it fails at least you tried, and if it succeeds you'll be the only one in the market with that set of features which gives you a competitive advantage which is exactly where you want to be.